Extension leads - electrical safety

[David WE Roberts]

I have been reading a few letters recently in the Caravan Club Magazine where they are waxing lyrical about the dangers of plugging a power lead into the power socket before plugging the other end into the caravan/camper socket.

i.e. you are walking across wet grass holding a live cable.

Thinking about this, how risky is it?

I think most people will plug in and switch on a long extension lead before unreeling it to a remote work site - trusting in the fact that the sockets do not have any exposed live bits. I think also few people walk back and switch off the extension lead each time they stop using a power tool for a bit - unplugging the tool eliminates the main risk.

The orange leads with the blue socket ends also do not have any exposed pins - the socket is deeply recessed and covered by a spring loaded cap.

So is there an appreciable risk or are the CC letter writers being a little to precious (as is their wont)?

Cheers

Dave R

[John Williamson]

If the socket is RCD protected as it should be, and, IIRC, must be in the UK, not at all.

The risk *might* come if you flip the cover back on the extension lead socket, and the rain gets into that socket, as against the rain getting into the fixed socket, which should be fitted pointing down. Even then, if the RCD is working correctly, there is no safety problem.

[Paul - xxx]

having been a caravanner and camper fopr many years I can categorically state that in my experience ...

.. is the right answer!

I've used campsites with a 'standard' electrical lead plugged into it, socket end in a plastic bag, in a tent many times, and we caravan now almost every weekend, certainly twice a month, and have never had an issue at all _ever_ with the electrical safety of the leads. (The campsite mains are a different story)

I can almost understand the concerns 'if I think about it' but practically the concerns amount to 4/5ths of f'all .. Having said that, I do plug the 'van in first before the mains socket, but then I do the same with kettle/computer leads etc, always have done!

I seem to remember an article in a caravan magazine, many years ago, that suggested there had been many accidents due to connecting wrongly, but when investigated further it appeared that the leads were wired wrongly and all the accidents had nothing to do with which end was plugged in first!

[Lieutenant Scott]

Sorry to hijack this thread, but on the subject of safety does anyone know what would happen to a computer or its power supply if you shorted 5V to 12V?

I spotted an adapter from a certain ebay seller for a 12V graphics card power plug (with a molex on the other end). But they had it wired so the 12V AND the

5V from the power supply's molex were joined together to feed 12V to the graphics card. Needless to say I didn't purchase this adapter, but got one from elsewhere. I told the seller they were going to have some very unhappy customers, and when they didn't listen I told ebay there was a dangerous item for sale, but all they did was say they would monitor that seller's activity.

I'm thinking that the power supply would shut down when it realised the problem (although it may only be protected against shorting 12V to ground and not to another line), but if the 5V line got raised up towards 12V, a lot of electronics in the computer could be damaged or catch fire?

[Bill]

In message , David WE Roberts writes

Minimal risk, RCD, if it is fitted, if it is working, should protect you. IF SHOULD............

I would worry about the socket on the lead having moisture in it and leaking through you to ground and also if you are walking the cable out and running it through your hands you could come in contact with a live wire if the cable was physically damaged.

For the sake of connecting it to the van first and walking the plug back to the supply socket is it really worth the risk? No matter how small? Many incidents occur due to the failure of more than one protection device, i.e. faulty RCD and a faulty cable insulation or connector. Talking of which you do regularly check the plug and socket on your cable don't you?

[Tim Streater]

I think you mean e.g., not i.e.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Start a new thread.

[Martin Brown]

I would expect (without having tried it) that on a good day the fairly mighty 5v supply would crowbar the 12v supply down hard and blow fuses somewhere. It might in the process damage something in the PSU.

I have once had a PC PSU catch fire with the magic smoke and sparks coming out of the back. Amazingly the PC was still running as I scrabbled to unplug it from the wall. The smoke was unpleasant.

Regards, Martin Brown

[hugh]

In message , Bill writes

General rule of safety - never rely on the safety device for your safety.

You can never predict totally what might happen and you should never underestimate the capacity of Joe Bloggs or his children to do something utterly unpredictable and stupid. So whilst we are all far too clever on this group to put ourselves at any risk the best general advice if asked is to say connect caravan end first.

[Owain]

It's less work to do it safely:

a) carry whole cable to the supply point, plug in, walk back to van carrying decreasing weight of cable, plug in at van

vs

b) plug in at van, carry decreasing weight of cablr to the supply point, plug in, walk back to van carrying nothing

Owain

[Brian Gaff]

I think its just that extension leads can get damaged and it pays to be careful especially if you don't use it very often. Brian

[Brian Gaff]

Yes, me too, then it went bang and stopped. There was ahole in one of the capacitors inside with some foul smelling gunk all over the place.

Brian

[Dave Liquorice]

Ensuring that the RCD is in the on position before you press the test button and when you do the RCD trips.

I'm in the "lazy" plug into van first walk to power point, laying the cable, test supply as above then connect, switching it on. I might have switched off the CU in the van and have polarity indicators as well to check before finally powering up the van.

[David WE Roberts]

No - camping in the UK I do mean "i.e."

[David WE Roberts]

.It's less work to do it safely:

.a) carry whole cable to the supply point, plug in, walk back to van .carrying decreasing weight of cable, plug in at van

.vs

.b) plug in at van, carry decreasing weight of cablr to the supply .point, plug in, walk back to van carrying nothing

OTOH it is sometimes neater (and safer) to start from the supply point, and unreel as you go back towards the van, leaving the extra cable coiled neatly just under the van instead of by the supply point, where it might create a trip hazard.

Unless you have a very (very) long cable, the weight of the cable isn't an issue.

Also, as we keep the camper on the drive and keep it powered up all the time, simplest way to uncouple if going out for a drive is to just unplug from the side of the camper and hang the live end over the side gate until we get back :-) Lazy, but we haven't fried yet.

[dennis]

What do you need a plastic bag for?

[Paul - xxx]

No idea, the wife insisted on it .. I went along with it for the quiet life. ;)

[Paul - xxx]

We used to do that in our last house .. till one week we came back early and found next doors caravan plugged into it to charge their battery! It wouldn't have been a problem if they'd asked, but it appears they used it every time we went away for the weekend, and never asked us once!

We do it again, now we have no neighbours!

[Huge]

Even if there is an appreciable risk, all that's going to happen is we end up with a few electrocuted caravanners, so what's the problem?

[dennis]

So where are they buried?