Drum brake skimming?

[The Natural Philosopher]

yes. Again I would always replace shoes on a setup that corroded just in case.

I used to help a friend who bought old cars and fixed them up. After a few complaints we simply stripped cleaned and replaced ANYTHING that looked dodgy. Not worth the hassle of having to do it twice.

[T i m]

I rang a place today and their menu price was 30 quid / drum for a skim.

I definitely need new bearings and at £23.78 / set, take that off a complete hub at £71.44 and it's still nearly 18 quid cheaper per side to skim than buy new.

I might see if I can get a bundle deal. ;-)

Cheers, T i m

[The Natural Philosopher]

That's pretty fair

Ouch.

But that's the way the cookie crumbles. I sold my old series III last week to the farmer. My wife looking on Ebay said 'its worth more than that!' I said, 'Not with a failed alternator bearing, dead battery, rotted brake pipes a hole in the floor and chassis and bugger all clutch it aint!.'

Not to mention the dodgy ignitions switch and the very rotted door window frames and the slow puncture. His lad will sort it all out at tech school and take it bunny hunting on the farm and have huge fun,.

And proably sell it for 800 wuid more when hes dioe with it. I say 'good!'

Anyway it paid for a second hand lawnmower from the old dear whose downsizing..

[Andy Dingley]

Electrolytic de-rust, whirly wheel brush and let the pads sort out the rest. Surface crud will wear off, ovality is your real problem.

Also check for cracking (on one design of hub sold for many trailers) where the drum & hub are one integral unit. The central tube carrying the bearings is machined with a stress riser on the inner corner, and the whole hub can crack off the bearing tube, losing your wheel.

[T i m]

Oh (good). ;-)

Ok.

Ah, so, the best I can find for his 84 2L petrol 4x4 Hi-Lux pickup is:

Kerb Weight (kg): 1350kg Gross Vehicle Weight (kg): 2480kg

So (to be sure I have this right) then:

85% (recommended percentage of trailer to tractor weight?) of 1350kg (Hi-Lux) is ~1150kg (max loaded trailer weight) and 2480 + 1150 aren't more than 3500kg he can drive it with all things fully loaded?

However that's 3630kg so if he carried 130kg less than max in the truck or ensures he never has the total weight of the trailer over say

1 tonne then he should be fine?

Cheers, T i m

[T i m]

Indeed and I generally do.

Good plan.

True. Worse is having to recover a crippled trailer from halfway between Nth London and Scotland.

Cheers, T i m

[Steve Walker]

You're almost right. You need to remember that it is MGW and MAM, not the actual weights that matter. The towing vehicle's MAM (or GVW) is still the stated 2480kg, whether it is carrying anything or not, therefore the trailer cannot exceed 1020kg MGW. Note that that is 1020kg MGW, not actual weight! He would have to re-plate the trailer to state the new MGW. If say the trailer was plated 1100kg MGW, he'd still be breaking the law, even if the trailer was empty! Daft I know, but that's how it works.

SteveW

[T i m]

Oooh, that's very interesting (he says looking at his old 12V 10A amateur radio PSU and a bag of washing soda).

Right, old plastic stacking box and some coat hanger as some 'iron' wire (to connect up the drum and bolted under a reversed wheel nut) and some Rebar (you can buy Rebar fencing stakes cheap) we should be good to go. ;-)

Thanks for the heads up.

Cheers, T i m

[T i m]

Wahee.

Ok (I was using 'weight' with a descriptor to try to keep it easier in my head). ;-(

Ah, ok.

Yup.

Ok ..

So what happens when you hire such a trailer, are you supposed to re-mark it for the duration of the hire?

And I assume this apply's to any vehicle (where this sort of thing would apply of course), even conventional passenger vehicles (not just goods / trucks)?

If so I'd better check we have the correct markings on all our cars and motorbikes (that have towbars) [1] and (4) trailers!

Cheers, T i m

[1] I know most if not all do have such markings (on little white labels).

[T i m]

Yeah. As a lightweight machinist and watching the brake skimming lathes_in_use videos on Youtube I thought it was ok as well.

Quite.

Oh yes, and on the flip side we have saved a fortune on the professionally constructed galvanised chassis, the hydraulically damped coupling, brake rods, suspension units, wheels etc etc.

Beggars can't be choosers etc.

That's the thing isn't it.

I was sold my old Rover 218SD 7+ years ago for £100 because it had a string of things wrong with it that would have cost my mate more that it was worth / sensible to /have fixed/. I on the other hand see such things as part of the cost of ownership and a hobby / challenge and a couple weeks later when I have the same mate a list he saw they had all been resolved (inc welding up the driver electric window mech that had buckled and fatigued over the years).

And that can be very time consuming stuff to 'fix' on the cheap (unless you happen to have a couple of donor vehicles to strip in yer barn).

Quite right. And at least it's living on etc.

It's funny the 'value' of things isn't it. Years ago Dad sold his baby Roliflex camera and with the money bought a 17' sailing cruiser. I've spent more money for a tiny pair of coil over shocks for an RC buggy that I have paid for some for our family car!

Cheers, T i m

[T i m]

Ok.

OK, I'll give them a close inspection once cleaned etc.

Cheers, T i m

[T i m]

It's not is it (or are /they/ of course. Just as you finish cleaning one of something you remember there are two). ;-(

That's why I was thinking it might need a skim (to get down to the good stuff). However, I'm going to start the electrical magic cleaning today and see what comes out.

If daughter hadn't nicked my wood turning lathe I think I could have mounted them up in that

True.

Can't you get abrasive brake pads to tidy up car disks ... if so I guess that might be what you would need for this.

Nor the bearings actually:

seals are ok were it not from the springs have rusted through.

From the following diagram I can now see what is supposed to happen re the brake adjuster:

removed the bolt from one back plate but nothing seemed to move or be released once I had. From that diagram I can see that there is a wedge that is drawn in by the adjuster bolt and that forces the two shoe mounts outwards (I didn't want to start knocking stuff about so just gave it a wire brush and a soak in Plus-Gas).

I've found this guide very handy so far: ;-)

T i m

[Dave Liquorice]

Ah I wondered if one was lifting hard to tell from the pic, leading or trailing edge? Not an expert of drum brake dynamics but I *think* a trailing edge will tend to get pushed down but a leading lifted up and bind.

Not a bad idea I guess.

[Roberts]

A wire brush in a drill should take off the worst and finish off with emery paper. If you are really fussy, soap filled Brillo pads will make it better than new!

Alan R

[Dave Liquorice]

I've seen worse, fine (400 or 800) wet on dry on the race and gently on rust the spots of each roller. Through wash in parafin to get all the bits out and regrease.

But as you say recovering a trailer and load with a seized wheel bearing and load from the middle of nowhere.

Are there any numbers/markings? You might be able to get the same bearing cheaper from a bearing specialist than as a spare part from the hub/brake maker.

[T i m]

I'll try to get some better pics after I've cleaned them a bit better.

That make sense. Assuming both linings didn't come off and the shoes weren't very worn or poorly adjusted I think even a completely detached lining with just sit against the remaining attached one, rather than getting anywhere nasty (and wouldn't work very well of course). Still not a theory I'd want to test mind. ;-)

Someone also suggested riveting them on 'as well' as at least we would be sure there wouldn't actually come off and could still serve as a bedding-in set.

I can remember the days when you only bought linings that you fitted yourself. ;-)

Cheers, T i m

[T i m]

If it was mine and I was just using to take stuff a few miles to the dump (and given they weren't cheap to replace) I'd give em a tidy up.

Quite.

Yup:

Inner: LM48549X/48510

Outer: L44649/44610

I've got some feelers out with a guy I've used before and he's asking around as well. I've asked him for 'VFM' bearings as (from experience) I don't particularly want cheap bearings in there but don't want to pay though the nose for something that could be considered 'overspec'. NTN's are what came out and I think they would fit that category.

The bearing supplier is having to put a bit more effort into getting the seal apparently.

AM 262 162 037

I thought exactly the same thing but I think WD40 fits in better for humour value (and probably more stereotypically and factually correct).[1]

On this trailer in general I do find it reasonably comforting that all the parts are 'mainstream'. So whilst they may not be the cheapest around they are available and a known quantity.

Cheers, T i m

[1] Like how many people think WD40 /is/ the right thing for every job. ;-)

p.s. And, of course there will be scenarios where WD40 /is/ a better releasing solution than PlusGas (not sure what but there must be). ;-)

[T i m]

I have found for any given type of rust there is a suitable wire brush. Like if its fine / surface a fine brush works best (not only best at removing the rust but not marking the surface).

For the stuff inside the drum I feel I need more like the very stiff type (like 3 twists of coat hanger) to cut through the skin that seems to be pretty resilient to the finer brush types (when then you just end up with 'polished rust'). ;-)

At the same time you don't want to dig up the underlying metal when you get to it. I'm looking forward (in a sad mad-scientist sorta way) trying this electrolysis rust removal technique.

Hey, we still have some Brillo pads under the sink and I was looking for a way of using them up. ;-)

Cheers, T i m

[Dave Plowman (News)]

No. I always look after brakes. Although my Midget had front discs. Had plenty Minis with front drums.

I was more referring to the sort of grooving found in normal service - not total abuse. ;-) If the drums are that bad, they are scrap.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

I'm not so sure. Even after extensive use of any wire brush on a pitted surface you don't get a perfectly bright result. If it is to be painted I use a small diamond burr which does get into the pits. And always produces rust dust.