Combis - no backup

[Bob]

So as I mentioned in another thread, I'm without a working boiler, and have no prospect of it being fixed for a few more days. I do at least have hot water thanks to the immersion, and I can heat the house, thanks to the open coal fires.

It did get me thinking, though. What if I'd had a combi? Or a modern house with only radiators for heat? I would have neither heat nor hot water at the moment. Combis may be compact "one box" solutions, but if any one of gas, electricity or water is lost, there is no backup alternative at all.

At least with my old fashioned system I can use electricity to provide hot water if the gas supply or the boiler itself fails. I have a tank of hot and a tank of cold water if the water supply is cut. I have fireplaces for heat (and potentially a little hot water) if any of the services or equipment fails.

I light of this, I'm not convinced that the modern solution is a real improvement on what came before. I don't think I'd ever go the combi route, unless I happened to buy a house that was already so fitted.

Mal

[Andy Hall]

It isn't.

Personally, if I ever were to buy a house with one fitted, I would replace it, simply because it would be inadequate for the application as well as having no backup.

I have a means of cooking that can also provide space heating if I want it to do so and without electricity, and a means of heating the water which involves no gas. I also have a means of storing a good supply of water in case there are problems with that - which there are from time to time.

.andy

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[Christian McArdle]

Just a normal gas boiler and storage system is enough, really. When my boiler blew up, I had immersion for hot water and fan heaters for heating. OK, so they're expensive to run, but who cares? It meant I could wait many weeks to get a new boiler installed, probably saving me over a thousand pounds compared to the price they charge desperate people who want stuff installed NOW. That buys a lot of electricity.

Christian.

[R Taylor]

we have a gas hob and if the gas fails we'll use the electric oven to cook with. an electric shower takes care of hot water for washing and the dishwasher is there for the washing up.

for heating, if our combi failed, we do have an open fireplace in the front room but this is the UK, ffs, not lapland, so being sans combi is not exactly not life threatening, is it :-)

when I bought my fist house I had no doors or windows OR floors for the first christmas and no central heating for the next.

we ate coal for xmas dinner and were bloody grateful for it, too.

RT

[Ric]

But you try telling the kids of today that, and they won't beleive you!

[Bob]

In that case, the government can stop spending £3bn a year paying old people's heating bills (are you listening Mr Brown? - there's some more money for you to grab)

[IMM]

An in-line instant electric heater can be installed to supply one tap and a shower. Not expensive and easy to do. You can buy cheap fan heaters and have them in the loft for heating backup.

If the power fails then a portable gas fire can be stored if you are really that desperate for heat. Or take it further and have a portable genny hooked up to your mains and throw a switch to bring in essential circuits. If there is a power outage "any" heating system will fail. It all depends on how far you want to go.

It certainly is.

You should understand what combi's are available and how to give cheap backup.

[IMM]

You obviously know nothing about combi's and how to give backup. That is sad.

[IMM]

Luxury! We lived in a lake.

[IMM]

Or stop paying 4.5 billon, 6 billion with BSE and F&M, on agricultural subsidies in an industry only worth 15 billion. Unbelievable! 40% subsidy and an industry that hogs 68% of the land mass. That is near 27% of the land is subsidised. Unbelievable!!

[Andy Hall]

What would you suggest? Two of them?

.andy

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[Andy Hall]

3kW shower? Hmm.

Installing a cylinder with immersion heater is pretty cheap and works surprisingly well.

What can you get for combis? Knitted covers? Two tone striped decals?

.andy

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[IMM]

Get syou wet and clean for a day or so. If you want full backup get two combi's. Combi's are cheap.

But takes up room. and they look awful with all the pumps and valves attached to them. Best get a Powermax.

That's a good idea.

[IMM]

Good thinking at last. I thought you would never get there. Congratulations!!!

Two W-B Juniors will deliver about 21 litres/min and if one drops out the other takes over. All for about £1100 and no tanks or cylinders or such stuff and natural,CH zoning. And as one poster suggested two Biasi's can be had for about £800 from B&Q. Great value and performance.

[Andy Hall]

About as useful as those wet wipes for cleaning the botty.

Two poor things does not improve a fundamental flaw in the principle of operation which is that all three services need to be working, and the device in order to get hot water.

I have backups for CH and for HW, the water and the electricity or gas can fail (and they have) and I still have usable provisioning of everything.

There's no point in that at all.

Do you sit with your airing cupboard door open admiring the sleek lines of your Gledhill box?

I thought so.

Maybe Gledhill do some.

.andy

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[IMM]

That is a good backup strategy.

Yea, get a genny.

They are the buiness and very neat.

It releases space in a cupboard that is for sure. No one is likely to pull on a CH pipe or hang clothes on the pump and zone valves (very common).

They should do to appeal to female of the house.

[Bob]

FFS :-(

[Bob]

Full backup my arse.

If the water or gas is off what does this second backup combi run on? Magic beans?

[Andy Hall]

Sigh.

.

Great idea :-(

If you like big boxes that need to be found room.

If you plumb a cylinder neatly it is no problem.

A given volume of water requires a given volume of space.

The important thing is to arrange the pipework properly and to provision appropriate shelves and hanging arrangements. Not very difficult.

Exactly. I thought that they would look good next to your tutu.

.andy

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[Ric]

Because they are just lovely to look at and take up no space at all.