choosing boiler

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So is your name really Cherie?
I can't think of anybody else who would say that, and from what I've heard, even she has a marginal view on that.......

.andy
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On Thu, 08 Jan 2004 13:30:47 +0000, IMM wrote:

like to

With approx 20 million gas heated homes in the UK that makes the average boiler life in the current housing stock about 15 years which accords with my experience. The ones which are shorter lived than this average IME would tend to be the low end combis.
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Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
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However, this is not a guide to lifetime of current boilers, it's a guide to lifetime of boilers fitted some 10 or more years ago, and as such I think it's a reasonable figure.
If, say, condensing boilers happen to have a lifetime of only 5 years, then this will not yet have had any noticable effect on these figures.
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Andrew Gabriel

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as
year
with
would
Combi's account for approx 65% of all boilers fitted. Many boiler are being ripped out for power shower performance and space saving, rather than the existing boiler being defective.
The whole nation is property developing, haven't you seen TV?
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On Thu, 08 Jan 2004 21:29:00 +0000, Andrew Gabriel wrote:

I accept your argument is true in prinicple. IMHO I don't think that the current replacement units are significantly different from what has gone before. True there are more crap combis to bring the average down but then there are also less open systems with dire pumping over or air entrainment.
The low tech boilers from the 70's are still going strong assuming there is no pumping over etc. However they tend to lose favour with their owners when there is a fault.
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<snip>
Not if you buy a Baxi Barcelona

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Andrew

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Thanks for that Andy but it's still 250-300 more than a non-condenser, and the budget is tighter than a ducks behind. Neil
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On Thu, 8 Jan 2004 20:02:56 +0000 (UTC), snipped-for-privacy@alumni.caltech.edu (Niel A. Farrow) wrote:

OK, well given that, the equation becomes projected reliability and maintenance costs in the context of how long you intend to keep the property. If it's going to be a shortish period then you might as well save the maximum on the capital outlay.
.andy
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The Ideal Icos is 670 quid for the 18kW modulating version, which is 120 quid more than the Thermocompact. Same for the Glowworm 18HXi.
Christian.
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The Glow Worm system boiler is cheaper than the heating boiler.
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On Wed, 7 Jan 2004 08:49:38 +0000 (UTC), snipped-for-privacy@alumni.caltech.edu (Niel A. Farrow) wrote:

No, it's perfectly fine unless you go to something ridiculously large.

I believe that their program does the traditional notion of adding in about 4kW for the cylinder plus 20% margin. You may also have the adder factor for intermittent heating.
Nowadays, the more typical design is to use hot water priority with a diverter valve. This means that the default is running the heating and when there is hot water demand, you switch the boiler over to the hot water cylinder. If you are using a cylinder to part L1 of the Building Regs. (you can generally only buy at least that), then it can use about 15kW of heat from the boiler and reheats reasonably quickly - so the notion of the 4kW for the cylinder isn't really needed. You take the boiler off line from the heating for a short time. A better bet is to use a fast recovery cylinder, which is able to use over 20kW. Some boilers even have a capability of a higher maximum output for driving the cylinder.
So you could consider changing the cylinder - it's not that expensive - if not, you can still design for the HW priority arrangement and perhaps change it later. It's only if you have a controls arrangement where both the heating and the HW can demand simultaneously that you need to allow for it with the boiler.

Vaillant generally receives good press here. Why not go for a condensing model, though. The boilers that you mention are at close to the bottom of the allowable energy efficiency range of 78%.
Vaillant have some corresponding condensing models(Ecomax), or several people here have had good success with the Keston Celsius 25 - which meets your requirements and can be had for about 650. Seasonal efficiency is in the 90% area, so you can works out that the payback will be comfortably within the boiler range. This one also modulates down to 7kW whereas the Vaillant to 13kW.

Honeywell's web site has wiring diagrams for their various control plans. Y plan or possibly S plan are the typical ones and are industry standard.

.andy
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On Wed, 07 Jan 2004 10:19:24 +0000, Andy Hall wrote:

Water heating counts as a 'zone' so for 3 or more zones S plan is the way. Y-plan is a sophisticated but in elegant solution to controlling a water and/or heating with only one motorized valve.
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(Niel

in.
Best use a proper quick recovery coil cylinder and a DHW priority system.
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Which is exactly what I went on to say........

.andy
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snipped-for-privacy@alumni.caltech.edu (Niel A. Farrow) wrote:

Look at Keston boilers, and their site www.keston.co.uk which has lots of info and diagrams and manuals. I have a Keston and am impressed. Richard
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