Been watching this guy fit his own Central Heating system. He's using plastic pipes rather than copper - mainly it seems on grounds of cost altough installation maybe be more flexible than copper
Just wonder what the grp think of using plastic here.
About 18 months ago, I had some radiators re-configured and associated pipework tidied up by a 'proper' heating engineer who was in doing some other work (good bloke, well informed' 'king expensive). He did it all in plastic and said that plastic is used for new builds now. The main reason was that you have fewer joints to leak and the flexible pipes are easier to route.
He took the pipework up behind the skirting (well, the skirting was off at that stage) and they come out behind the radiators, which would be a lot more work in copper. I think it looks way better like that than coming through the carpet and have installed others the same way as I've changed them. The other advantage (as he pointed out) is that it allows you to lift a rad from the brackets and lat it down whilst decorating behind. No disconnection or faffing about.
My greatest concern was that his calculation indicated far less radiator acreage than the room had previously. We actually installed a bit more than the calculation said but there has neevr been a problem with the temperature in that room, although insulating the floor well contribute to that, I'm sure.
Also no value to thieves and no naked flames required - a concern with timber frame constuction.
My main concern is the push-fit fittings usually used. They have a rated life of 25 years (life of the O-ring seals), which is very much less than compression or soldered fittings. You can use compression fittings on plastic pipe, but that never seems to be done (and I don't know if it increases the life to that of compression fittings on copper).
The other thing is that the workmanship with plastic installations is often poor, e.g. incorrectly supported pipes pulling on fittings, which results in a much shorter life.
On Wednesday 29 January 2014 23:51 Andrew Gabriel wrote in uk.d-i-y:
And scratched pipe as in that video...
Not to mention the sudden failure of a push fit joint is catastrophic - the gradual failure of a pinhole leak in copper much less so.
In article , dave writes
There's nothing wrong with using appropriate plastic tube in a ch installation. I have separate continuous plastic feeds here between the boiler distribution point and each radiator with no joints in between, it's a very clean system.
Be aware that many boiler specs require copper within a specified distance of the boiler to meet overheat specs, usually about a metre or so.
I didn't view the video.
In article , Tim Watts writes
No need to use pushfit on plastic pipe, my installation uses far cheaper compression fittings which I view as more robust and durable.
No-one can say how long plastic pipe will last. Copper will last fifty years though someof the new stuff is hardened and super thin & may therefore be dodgy.
I certainly wouldn't be wanting to bend plastic pipe after it had been in for a few years, may well have degraded due to hot water Plenty of stories on this group about joint failures.
However, there are new heating technologies comng along all the time. No point in outlasting it's obsolescence.
Are you sure you don't mean a 26 year warranty, which you don't get on compression or solder.
The plastic pipe I replaced a few months ago was perfect after 30 years. There are plenty of copper joint and pipe failures too, but they aren't news.
On Thursday 30 January 2014 00:05 fred wrote in uk.d-i-y:
Which system is that?
Standard brass compression fittings for copper tube, but when used on plastic, you *must* use pipe inserts in the plastic pipe ends.
On Thursday 30 January 2014 08:48 Andrew Gabriel wrote in uk.d-i-y:
OK - with you now... I did something similar on MDPE - compression olive, brass fitting, insert. Rock solid.
I spent the morning of Christmas Day repairing a minute split in a PolyPipe hot water pipe - it sprayed an aerosol of hot water for days before we found it. The length I removed had hardened since 1999 and was crumbly inside - I think it is fine for cold water but I won't use it for hot.
On 29/01/2014 23:51, Andrew Gabriel wrote: snip
I thought JS Speedfit had a 'design life' of 50 years?
Agree there - just fitted a plastic washing machine valve/pipe connector on the end of some copper tubing, and looks very precarious
Ahem - I got some 22mm CH plastic pipe from Screwfix, and I'm buggered if I can see how it can persuaded to straighten from its coil.
Makes for rather a short run ;-)
In message , Geoff Pearson writes
Sounds like poor quality pipe. I removed some from here recently - it must have been Hep2O, but must have been in many years, the pipe seemed fine
There are different types of pipe - Polybuytlene is a bit more flexible, PEX stiffer (the straight length are handy though when you want to have nice straight bits when you cut it, PEX is easier to cut as well)
I usually use Speedfit - the 'Layflat' pipe is Polybuytlene, and while it comes off the roll curved, with a little bit of reverse bending you can get it pretty straight - I cabled some 22mm through joists in the bathroom refit recently ok.
Friends had it fitted in their heated conservatory extension, it failed within 5 years.
Most modern (i.e. last 30 - 40 years) commonly available copper is generally BS 2871-1 Table X "half hard" or semi annealed if you prefer. Wall thickness on 15mm should be about 0.7mm
The Table Y stuff (which you can/could get in both half hard and annealed) is 1.0mm wall thickness, but you don't often see this for sale these days.
There is also a Table Z for "hard drawn" tube, that has a wall thickness of only 0.5mm. Don't think I have ever seen that in domestic use.
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