Can a hospital bed go upstairs?

[junk1]

Wasnt sure what news group to post this question to as it crosses a few boundaries.

Basically my disabled nan has been living at home (a bungalow) and receiving help from Bromley social services to lift her out of bed using a hoist and take her to the toilet etc. We all want her to move in with my father who owns a house in Maidstone, but Maidstone social services are not being entirely helpful and the lastest hurdle is that they say a hospital bed is not allowed upstairs - but they didnt give a reason.

The bed does dismatle so we could get it up the stairs, but were wondering if there was a weight restriction on the bedroom floor?

...ie with the special bed, plus hoist plus three adults would the floor be in danger of giving way?

Its a modern house (4 years old) Does anyone know how strong the floors have to be?

If houses are built with such a large safety margin that there is absolutaly no danger with three adults and a special hospital bed then at least we can know that social services are misleading us.

Any help grately appreciated.

Thanks

David Bevan

[dom]

I suspect complete bollocks. Max imposed floor loading should be something like 1.5KN/m2 - i.e. 150Kg per square metre.

[The3rd Earl Of Derby]

Are you sure? I have a friend who has a treadmill and a weightlifters bench with the weights attached to the frame in the same room.

[RicodJour]

The weight is not an issue. I'm not sure of your particular code requirements, but 30 or 40 pounds per square foot is a typical design load. Hospital beds aren't particularly heavy.

I don't think social services is misleading you. They said the bed wasn't allowed upstairs but didn't give a reason. If they gave you a bogus reason, then they're misleading you. If they have regulations that prohibit the bed being on the second floor for whatever reason, and they're just telling you about the prohibition, that's not misleading you.

You should ask to see the regulations that govern what type of bed is allowed in what locations. Maybe they're misreading the regulation, maybe they're simply wrong.

R

[Martin Davies]

Just because floor loading should be a certain figure generally doesn't stop people putting things on that floor. Come to think of it, there are people heavier than that.

Martin <

[Steve Walker]

More likely that they don't see any compelling necessity to carry all their equipment up and down in the course of her treatment & care (and occasionally carry her up & down too). There's a reasonable argument that this wastes staff time, raises H&S issues, etc.

[dom]

AIUI the calculated max imposed loading is based upon a maximum accpetable defelection (something like 3mm) and based on continuous longterm load - NOT the instantaneous load failure point.

[John]

A couple of thoughts come to mind. As hospitals have wards above the ground floor, it can only be relavent to a domestic property. Many houses have suspended timber floors on the ground floor of exactly the same design as the upper floor. I suspect they are trying it on. Ask for the specific regulation and then check it.

John

[Roger Mills]

I'm sure that the joists can support the distributed load. It's possible that the point loadings are too high for a chipboard floor - so this may need to be re-inforced.

[John Cartmell]

My mother couldn't be nursed at home because regulations wouldn't allow two nurses to lift her without special lifting equipment. In the (expensive) nursing home, that my father had to travel to twice daily in order to ensure that she was fed properly, she was (easily) lifted by one nurse with no equipment. There are words to describe those regulations but those words are not fit for the ears of anyone except those responsible for making and implementing the regulations. To be eaten - laced with arsenic.

[Martin Davies]

So a heavy person sat in an armchair watching TV every night wouldn't affect it? :)

Martin <

[Martin Davies]

I've worked as a nurse in a nursing home. Two people are pretty standard for lifting anyone, where possible, at least in the homes I've ever been in. Sometimes a hoist is used, makes things easier on the staff. Avoids strain and injury to one person, gives often more stability to the patient, and less likely to drop them. Oh, and don't need to be in the top

10 sstrongest people in the neighbourhood. Even the lightest adult to be lifted is still a much heavier load for one person than many of us attempt outside a gym. And few of us attempt to lift a load of 50kg+ while standing.

The regulations aren't always good, but do try and prevent injury to the nurses.

Martin <

[Golden State Poppy]

A person this disabled would be much better off in an assisted living place. Many are quite good. She would have companionship as well.

[John Rumm]

The max deflection is actually given as a proportion of the joist length. For joists up to 5 or 6m (can't remember which!) this is 0.003 * Lenght. For joists longer than this it is a fixed limit of 14mm. Short term loads can be up to 1.75 times the long term rating.

[John Rumm]

It is rated for 150kg on *every* square meter. Hence by virtue of having far less load most of the floor area, you can have lots more concentrated over some of it and still be within the design loading limits.

[Phil Anthropist]

handling risk assessment and from that decided that carrying the bed parts upstairs is too risky for their staff. I doubt that it is a floor weight issue as some people have a water bed in an upstairs bedroom, and we all know the weight of water. The metal beds supplied by social services don't look any heavier than ordinary domestic double divan beds. If they will deliver to the ground floor perhaps you can carry it upstairs.

[Tone]

I resemble that remark !

[Tone]

Actually I think you will find it IS based on an instantaneous load failure point. Calculating that point will give overall failure rate.

But getting sensible about the whole thing. Don't ask the LAanything untill AFTER the fact.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

There are rightly so regulations about lifting. Do you know how many medical staff end up with back complaints?

Well, if they can't be bothered to feed her properly do you really expect they give a damn about the H&S of their staff?

Lifting equipment is cheap compared to the health of a nurse. What other equipment has this private nursing home skimped on?

[John Adams]

I am sure there is no general rule about placement of Adjustable beds, it is more likely that they have decided that the particular bedroom is too small, or the doors are opening inward, or somesuch. Ask them. They have the power, you are going to have to work with them.=20

I know it is galling, but you may well have to compromise on what you would like, and what the Council deem to be safe in the specific house your Nan will be moving to. And bear in mind that , however nitpicking you may think there rules, they are designed to protect your Nan, your Dad and their Care-Staff. The rules don't always work perfectly, but hey, that's life, and they can be changed!

Be prepared, if necessary, for her to sleep downstairs, and to convert the bedroom into a Living Room. I had the same problem with my wife for almost a year, but in the end solutions were found.