Bottle gas piping query

[robgraham]

We're in the sticks so the cooker is off bottle gas.

I want to move the connection point (and consequently the bottle!) along a good couple of metres.

There is no technical problems that I can see, but I don't know what fittin gs I should be using to extend the pipe. The connection point is a standar d item that has two hoses and a changeover tap. The feed pipe to the cooke r I thought was 10mm but it measures a good 0.5mm less (ie 9.3mm) in diamet er than the 10mm pipe I have - and have just used to extend the oil feed fo r the CH boiler.

Are bottle gas pipe fittings different from water / oil or is this just an acceptable variation ?

Rob

[Huge]

My bottled gas is plumbed in standard 15mm copper pipe with soldered fittings, which is what I used when I moved our bottles.

[Fredxxx]

How old is this pipe? 3/8" is close to 9.5mm.

I thought that water and gas pipe sizes were the same!

[F Murtz]

I want to move the connection point (and consequently the bottle!) along a good couple of metres.

There is no technical problems that I can see, but I don't know what fittings I should be using to extend the pipe. The connection point is a standard item that has two hoses and a changeover tap. The feed pipe to the cooker I thought was 10mm but it measures a good 0.5mm less (ie 9.3mm) in diameter than the 10mm pipe I have - and have just used to extend the oil feed for the CH boiler.

Are bottle gas pipe fittings different from water / oil or is this just an acceptable variation ?

Rob

Silver solder and or flared fittings.

[Harry Bloomfield]

You cannot use ordinary lead solder on joints for propane, it will leak. You have to use silver solder.

[A.Lee]

Have you got a link to back that up? I've been on a number of jobs with bottled gas and they have always used normal lead (or lead substitute) solder.

[robgraham]

g a good couple of metres.

ttings I should be using to extend the pipe. The connection point is a sta ndard item that has two hoses and a changeover tap. The feed pipe to the c ooker I thought was 10mm but it measures a good 0.5mm less (ie 9.3mm) in di ameter than the 10mm pipe I have - and have just used to extend the oil fee d for the CH boiler.

an acceptable variation ?

Good thinking that man !! It's a good 20 years old and certainly I'd used

10mm pipe about then for a remote radiator, but you never know what a build er might 'just' use !! And it could well have been there were 3/8" olives around then.

Any further guidance on the comment further on in the thread about only usi ng silver solder for propane. It does occur to me that if lead solder leak s then I would have thought that compression fittings wouldn't haven't have worked either.

My thinking with this pipe is to anneal it, expand it out a bit with a suit able tool (metal working lathe available), and making a solder joint.

Rob

[Brian Gaff]

Perhaps its French, and they nearly always come up with something unique to themselves. grin. Brian

[Andrew Mawson]

If lead solder leaks on Propane then my cylinders must be empty after all these year, oddly enough they are NOT empty !

Andrew

[robgraham]

Having had a good poke around on the topic of silver solder, it would seem this is 'desirable' as it is a far higher melting point than lead based. B ut it is not infinitely higher so will melt with a fire anyway.

My pipe is outdoors of a 3ft thick stone wall so is less of concern ! And I'll go with Andrew's comment, particularly when one considers that a compr ession joint is likely to be less gas tight than a lead soldered one, and t hat is what I have at the moment.

Rob

[Andrew Mawson]

Any concerns regarding temperature and solder pale in the light of the flexible (butyl rubber?) pipes used in these installations.

Andrew

[Huge]

What he said.

[Michael Chare]

If the gas is for cooking is it not butane?

I suspect the OP's pipe is 1/4 inch. I have joined this pipe size using

10mm solder fittings for my oil fired boiler. The oil dissolves the solder, so it is not good for a permanent solution.

We like our induction electric hob and having had electric hobs for more that 25 years I find hobs with naked flames quite alarming to use as well as being awkward to clean.

[John Williamson]

Usually big red bottles of propane. Butane stops working at about 0C. I made that mistake the first winter I spent living in a caravan. It got rectified after the first frosty night.

? More likely it creeps through pinholes created by dissolving the residue of the flux used. Or the joint wasn't as good as it looked at first inspection.

[Tim+]

Not much use in winter.

Tim

[Vir Campestris]

Ours is propane

We had an induction hob in our last house. Between ordering it and having it fitted I was made redundant :( and the new house has bottled gas. The induction was better than anything else I've used - and I think I've used them all.

The new house also has a 15+yo kitchen that we can replace, a garden that's too big to mow (1), views across the fields to the sunset... I could go on.

Andy

[robgraham]

Is that a real 1/4 inch or one of those odd pipe definitions?

I disconnected the pipe this afternoon to see what type of coupling it was and I go now with someone earlier in the thread who suggested 3/8" external diameter as the "Calor" unit on the wall will not take 10mm pipe, so this may be called "1/4 in." pipe but it's 3/8" actual, which at 9.3mm actual wi ll not couple with a 10mm pipe safely - bugger.

Anyone got any bright ideas please.

Rob

[Nightjar]

On 15/04/2014 15:14, Andrew Mawson wrote: ...

Butyl rubber can be formulated not to soften until around 185-200C and not to decompose until around 350C. 60/40 lead tin solder will melt at

188C. Lead free plumbing solder will melt at around 220C.

Colin Bignell

[Fredxxx]

Just to confuse, generally imperial measurements were the internal bore size, whereas metric sizes tend to be external diameter.

[Andrew Mawson]

Piece of cake if you have a lathe. Simple brass rod bored the appropriate diameters each end and used as an end feed solder joint. Take me 10 mins once I'd found a suitable bit of brass from my stock pile. Need to leave a couple of thou slack for the solder to capillary suck into the joints.

Andrew