13A sockets - relocation

[Mike Abbott]

Greetings all, Could I seek the expertise of the list re moving some 13A sockets please...

Situation is a breakfast room in a 1950's house. 'Pre-extension' this was the kitchen and therefore the rooms' two double 13A sockets are at 'worktop height'.

I'd like to drop these nearer to the floor. I don't know at the moment how the cable is located in the wall - conduit, or just buried in the plaster (but I suspect the latter).

Q: The wisdom (or otherwise ;) of burying a small junction box at the location of the existing socket to add a short drop of new cable, and plastering over it. Or is it wise to trace the exisiting cable back to it's start and install a complete run of new cable (presumably from the floorspace above)?

Mike A.

[Lurch]

On Thu, 04 Mar 2004 11:06:16 +0000, in uk.d-i-y Mike Abbott strung together this:

Most definitely not a good idea, all junction boxes etc... should be accessible.

That would be better, there will probably be 2 cables in each socket going upwards. If you pull both of these up to above the ceiling and drop one new cable down from there and terminate all three cables in a

30A junction box

[Set Square]

Based on earlier similar discussions, the official answer is that you should not use screw terminals anywhere where they will be inaccessible - but that crimped connections are ok. Thus, if you crimp the joints, you can insulate them and plaster over them. However, if you use chocolate block connectors, you will need to replace the existing sockets by blanking plates so as to leave the junctions accessible.

Having said that, if you make a decent job of joining the wires with screw connectors, I can see no practical reason (other than compliance with the regs!) for not plastering over them. I have done this in one or two cases, leaving the box in place and making a hardboard cover for it within the plaster depth, and finishing off with a skim of Pollyfilla.

Cheers, Set Square

[Harry Bloomfield]

Set Square wrote on Thursday (04/03/2004) :

I would dispute the wisdom of plastering over any sort of connections, crimped or otherwise.

The most satisfactory method is to replace any cables which are not long enough, or perhaps excavate the cables out of the walls to enable them to be moved to a location which does not involve joints, or even a combination of the two.

If the ground floor is suspended (wood), likely the wiring will be below the floor and simply need to be shortened back, rather than extended.

[Andy Minter]

There is a lot to be said, particularly as you get older, for having sockets at worktop height in any room. However your milage, as they say, may vary.

[Gin Smith]

in my very similar situation - i discovered in my old kitchen (now breakfast room) that cables for the sockets on the wall were routed up the wall from under the floor (ground floor ring). The cables were installed in some steel conduit which were plastered into the wall. I just lifted the floor boards and carefully pulled the cables back through, cut them the length and installed new sockets at appropriate level. So I would check whether the cables actually do come from the floor above.

Gin

[Owain]

"Set Square" wrote | > Q: The wisdom (or otherwise ;) of burying a small junction box | > at the location of the existing socket to add a short drop of | > new cable, and plastering over it. Or is it wise to trace the | > exisiting cable back to its start and install a complete run | > of new cable (presumably from the floorspace above)? | Based on earlier similar discussions, the official answer is that | you should not use screw terminals anywhere where they will be | inaccessible - but that crimped connections are ok. Thus, if you | crimp the joints, you can insulate them and plaster over them. | However, if you use chocolate block connectors, you will need to | replace the existing sockets by blanking plates so as to leave | the junctions accessible.

You will also have to be aware that the cables may no longer be running in the permitted zones (up/down/left/right from a *visible* accessory) and so may need physical protection.

Owain

[Mike Abbott]

Many thanks to you all. As always, you've provided useful info and points to consider. I'll sit down, open a beer and consider my options ;)

Mike A.

[Timothy Murphy]

I have a somewhat similar query. We have installed a new kitchen, and the sockets are now in inappropriate places (eg behind the hob). It is not practical to excavate the wiring from the walls. Is there any way to install new sockets a couple of feet away?

[Lurch]

On Fri, 05 Mar 2004 00:12:25 +0000, in uk.d-i-y Timothy Murphy strung together this:

Normally I'd say surface in trunking, but with some being near a hob the heat tends to melt and discolour it afer a while. If they are on stud walls then you may be able to 'fish' the cables around the back of the wall to the new positions and use surface mounted sokets.