wires to capacitor on YORK AC unit are burned and melted

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Yup, I see that too. And the other capacitor left and below the contactor/relay (terminals on the top) may be even worse.
[Didn't get a chance to enlarge the picture and go over it carefully until now.]
If I recall other postings in this thread correctly, the previous serviceman replaced the original single-can "dual" capacitor with two singles.
In summary: both capacitors are rusty, and at least one of the contactor/relay unit connection terminals is more-or-less heat and corrosion destroyed - the gray/blue "staining" on the terminal mounting 'ear' (plastic or bakelite, likely the latter) shows it's been grossly overheated - the metal strap and screw are _badly_ damaged, and it should not be trusted.
[Another terminal may be just as bad, but none of the pictures show sufficient closeup detail.]
I think the OP needs a _reputable_ serviceman come visit and test out the entire thing.
If he stays with two capacitors, the one with the terminals facing "up" should be inverted. As it is, it's a water/rust trap.
Given the sloppy workmanship, I'll bet that the capacitor values are grossly wrong, which could lead to wires melting too.
--
Chris Lewis, Una confibula non set est
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obviously...no. You have not given the model number or serial number to the unit. Depending on the model and serial, you may have a couple of items, and if you will get that and either post it, or send it this way, we can pull up the unit, and tell you what is the most likely problem.

Nope...not always.

See the reply above. Once I know what model and run line of unit you have, then its a simple matter of pulling it up on cd and badda bing...there you go.
The reason I need that, is that some of those had issues, that looked one way, and were another.

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The unit is a York Model H2DAQ42SQ6A. The Serial Number is ELBM396211.
Here are the links to some photos showing the burned wires. I thought the burned wires were connected to the capacitor but they are not. See the photos for a better explanation.
http://home.earthlink.net/~noharmdoneband/Img1833.jpg
http://home.earthlink.net/~noharmdoneband/Img1834.jpg
http://home.earthlink.net/~noharmdoneband/Img1835.jpg
http://home.earthlink.net/~noharmdoneband/Img1836.jpg
http://home.earthlink.net/~noharmdoneband/Img1837.jpg
Thanks for your help.
Keith
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This is Turtle.
You can stop right here for i'm looking at the effect of a loose connection wire burn out. I see them all the time when the connection of the wire is not tight and it will just burn off. Replace the contractors and run new wire to the compressor to the contactor and you will never hear from it again , but tighten the connection real good and don't use the male spades if all possible , also.
TURTLE
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What is the amp draw at that wire? When was the last time the condenser was flushed?

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I have not taken any measurements on the unit, neither did any of the technicians who worked on it. One tech said that he would be glad to keep charging me $100 for each visit to replace the wires. Otherwise, I should buy a new unit. I will do that if I have to but not sure I need a new unit to fix the problem.
I bought the house 4 years ago and the unit was about 5 years old when I bought the house. I don't know that is has ever been flushed. Neither tech suggested that to me.
Keith

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This is Turtle.
If the Tech / service company can't tighten up the connection enough to keep them from burning off. Two thing is taking place here. 1) He is wanting to sell you a new condener by leaving the connection loose and let them burn off. 2) The tech just does not know how to tighten up the connection correctly.
Run their ass off before the mess something up here and you may really have to buy a condenser.
TURTLE
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I fully agree with Turtle that the contactor (relay) is bad.
I'm not a HVAC technician, but I am an electrical engineer with 15 years of experience testing contactors and relays. The photos show that the terminals are corrode; chances are, the contacts of the contactor are as well. Fungus, corrosion, and normal usage can cause an increase of resistance on electrical contacts. An increase of resistance will cause a voltage drop to appear across the contacts of the contactor thus making the contacts dissipate more power (heat). From what I see, the wires are burned near the relay. I have seen this condition many times in relays that were under test. The contacts get hot enough to melt the insulation on the wires near the relay but not hot enough to melt the relay. Replace the relay and the wires and that should solve your problem.
Turtle is a smart cookie.
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Sounds reasonable. The first time the wires burned through it was at the capacitor. The second time it was at the relay. The third and current time is at the relay but the wires going to the capacitor looks fine. I will replace the relay and wires and hopefully that will make a difference. Each time I have had burned or melted wires they have been at the connectors so hopefully this will fix the problem.
Thanks to everyone for their assistance.
Keith

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Don't be surprised to find that contactor full of ants. For some reason they are attracted to those things like bees to pollen. Nothing like a dozen flattened insects to raise resisance.
|Sounds reasonable. The first time the wires burned through it was at the |capacitor. The second time it was at the relay. The third and current time |is at the relay but the wires going to the capacitor looks fine. I will |replace the relay and wires and hopefully that will make a difference. Each |time I have had burned or melted wires they have been at the connectors so |hopefully this will fix the problem. | |Thanks to everyone for their assistance. | |Keith |
| |> I fully agree with Turtle that the contactor (relay) is bad.|> |> I'm not a HVAC technician, but I am an electrical engineer with 15 years|of |> experience testing contactors and relays. The photos show that the|terminals |> are corrode; chances are, the contacts of the contactor are as well.|Fungus, |> corrosion, and normal usage can cause an increase of resistance on |> electrical contacts. An increase of resistance will cause a voltage drop|to |> appear across the contacts of the contactor thus making the contacts |> dissipate more power (heat). From what I see, the wires are burned near|the |> relay. I have seen this condition many times in relays that were under |> test. The contacts get hot enough to melt the insulation on the wires near |> the relay but not hot enough to melt the relay. Replace the relay and the |> wires and that should solve your problem.|> |> Turtle is a smart cookie.|> |> | |
Rex in Fort Worth
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This is Turtle.
I got my Computor to zoom in on the contactors for a look at the points of the contactor for to see if or how bad they were burnt and seen no signs of ants. That thought is a very good ideal to look for because they can take a set of contactor out in just a day or so.
TURTLE
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TURTLE wrote on Thu, 12 Feb 2004 17:28:15 GMT :

That's because they take soooo many coffee breaks, and always "Forgot something back at the hill."
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Aww jeez, now there's some wit-less wing-nut running around claiming you
stole his half.
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Couple things. First, Turtle is a smart cookie, and from what I can read of his posts, an excellent repairman.
I did look at a couple of the pictures. Since the wire from the cap goes to a terminal block (and two other things) it makes me wonder if this is a load carrying wire, not just from the comp to the cap. The wire you pointed to with the arrow does appear smaller than the other wires.
Wonder if a dab of Noalox would be a good idea for these press on terminals? Cut down on corrosion.
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Christopher A. Young
Jesus: The Reason for the Season
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Turtle, I see _significant_ corrosion on the terminal screw (on at least) the lower of the two hot spots. See first picture - has the best view.
Not only is the screw and metal conductor corroded to crap, the black plastic (or bakelite) on the terminal is clearly baked and is going to start disintegrating.
You can winch new wire down as much as you want, but with that much corrosion on the terminal, it's never going to stay "fixed".
The pictures aren't good enough to tell if the upper terminal connection is as badly damaged.
That thing appears to be a relay. I think it needs to be replaced or refurbished somehow. If it's the start relay (see my other posting), the contacts may also be sticking (or permanently stuck) and be the original cause of the whole mess.
I can't believe a serviceman would simply replace that wiring harness without at least commenting about the condition of the relay. Sheesh!
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This is Turtle.
He wants to see a condenser unit when it burns again.
TURTLE
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Ah, gee. Now we got to install flush valves on condensors, as well as toilets? You sure you know something about AC? You sound more like a plumber who got talked into "Oh, yes! Can you look at my AC".
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Christopher A. Young
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"Keith Reding" snipped-for-privacy@earthlink.net wrote in message jjsWb.164$ snipped-for-privacy@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net

Keith, after viewing your pictures and reading the various posts, as a tech I'd take the following steps to remedy your situation: 1) replace the one pole contactor with another 1 pole contactor, 40 amp rating 2) cut the wiring back to clean, unburnt copper and crimp on eyelet connectors that attach to the contactor with screw lugs 3) replace the capacitors with either single capacitors rated for their respective loads (condenser fan motor and compressor) or as CB mentions, the correct dual cap that originally came with that unit. 4) ensure that the wiring lugs at the compressor terminals are electrically tight, not corroded, and NOT of the male spade variety, as Turtle mentioned. Install split bolts if you have to. 5) like the moron tony berlin suggested, flush your condenser. what he really meant was wash the condenser coils to ensure cleanliness, free from dirt and debris. 6) ensure every high voltage electrical connection was tight, starting from the circuit breaker panel, to the disconnect, to the connections inside the condenser. 7) finally, depending on a lot of factors, i may install a hard start kit. you see mr berlin, i'd be looking at my startup and RLA AFTER i'd completed ALL of the above steps.
On a side note CB, your star will shine alot brighter when you cease with your unprovoked attacks on SM. I give the guy credit for at least asking questions, its just unfortunate he had to ask them of that brain dead egotistical tony berlin.

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The AC originally had a single capacitor but the first repair guy said it was crap and replaced it with the two separate units.
Keith

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