When a gallon is not a gallon

Page 5 of 7  


Are you really expecting an answer to those questions?
If I must...
To keep it simple, here's a short program I wrote:
PSL = Posted Speed Limit DS = Driver's Speed IF DS > PSL Then Driver Guilty of Speeding
How would you like it to read?
PSL = Posted Speed Limit DS = Driver's Speed IF DS > PSL Then If Driver has been driving the route every day forever then Driver Not Guilty of Speeding Else Driver Guilty of Speeding
Gimme a break. The town has no *obligation* to inform drivers of a change in the speed limit or of the parking rules. Would it be nice if they did? Sure. Do they try to do it in most cases? Sure. However, it's the obligation of the person driving the route or parking his car to read the signs and follow the rules or risk paying the consequences. Just like it's the obligation of the shopper to read the labels and determine for themselves how much they're getting and how much they're paying for it.
Ya know, by your logic, we shouldn't have to pay the same price for the smaller package because they didn't tell us beforehand. Let me know how that works out for you.
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PSL = Posted Speed Limit DS = Driver's Speed IF DS > PSL Then Driver Guilty of Speeding
How would you like it to read?
PSL = Posted Speed Limit DS = Driver's Speed IF DS > PSL Then If Driver has been driving the route every day forever then Driver Not Guilty of Speeding Else Driver Guilty of Speeding
=============== Nice, but you forgot to close your loop with an ENDIF or something. :-)
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On 02/29/08 12:30 pm DerbyDad03 wrote:

The speed limit illustration demonstrates another result of decentralization and letting every little tin-pot community make its own rules. When I was growing up in UK there was only one speed limit: 30mph (with some clearly posted exceptions, such as within x feet/yards of a hospital entrance, where it might have been 20mph or less). So it was 30mph or unrestricted. If there was "a system of street lighting" (defined, ISTR, as a system of lights spaced not more than x feet/yards apart -- so a solitary street light miles from anywhere didn't count), the speed limit was 30mph unless otherwise indicated. If there was no such "system of street lighting," there was no speed limit, unless otherwise indicated -- and that indication had to be repeated by miniature speed-limit signs spaced not more than x feet/yards apart. None of this one speed limit sign hidden behind bushes at the township limit and a police officer lurking around the next bend with a radar gun. (Later they introduced a 40mph speed limit, some areas going from 30mph to 40mph and some going from no limit to 40mph. BTW, one survey showed that drivers often slowed down on going from a 30mph zone to a 40mph zone: a 30mph limit was too low to be taken seriously, but 40mph was reasonable.)
In New York I used to drive one stretch of road quite often. The road conditions and population density were about the same, but the speed limit varied from 40mph to 25mph to 35mph to 30mph, depending on the whim of the particular village's legislators. Ridiculous!
(I just remembered that in one or two places in the USA I have seen advance warning signs reading "New Speed Limit Ahead.")
Perce
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Damned sure I'll protest. Good chance I'll beat it also based on historic renderings of most traffic courts. .
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No argument there, but please explain how this has anything to do with the fact that Ice Cream no longer comes in 64 oz containers.
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DerbyDad03 wrote:

Just reread what I wrote. You seem to be really missing the idea that people get used to things and it isn't fair if you a just change stuff without notice.
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George wrote:

Gosh, where I come from I am not sure that it ever came in 64 oz containers.
Of course back in the day my Gallon was 160 oz so my quart would have ben 40 oz etc.
And of course no one here (that I have seen) has addressed the issue of how much air might be incorporated in the ice cream, fat content etc.
So, while this is all fun and gams to discuss it really can not and will not settle anything.
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Edwin Pawlowski wrote:

not follow the required notification procedure. All of the tickets they issued were invalidated.
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.
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zzzzzzzzzzzz......
If you can't read the signs, you're in the 90% of drivers who are incompetent in one way or another.
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.
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DerbyDad03 wrote:

Tell that to the local "Smithville" that installed lower speed limit signs and didn't follow the state's required procedure that requires that a flasher be attached to the signs for so many days to call attention to the change. All of the speeding tickets that were issued in the reduced speed area were invalidated.

Please don't put words in my mouth. I never said anything nonsensical like that.
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I stand corrected on the speed limit issue, as least as far as "Smithville" is concerned.
re: Please don't put words in my mouth. I never said anything nonsensical like that
Then what was your point in bringing up the speed limit and parking issues? I'll trust your assertion that there is a state required procedure related to traffic law, but as far as I know there is no such procedure governing the size of an ice cream container.
You gave 2 examples of changes that came without notification and asked if I would pay the fines. If you're not implying that I should also not have to pay for the smaller packages because I wasn't notified, how are those examples related to this discussion?
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DerbyDad03 wrote:

I gave those as examples of human nature. Your claim was that it wasn't dishonest to shrink packages because people could read the labels. Once people have learned something we don't examine the minutia each time and just go on with life. So when we buy the "gallon" ice cream we reach for the package that has always represented a gallon.
Just like when you twist a light bulb to the left to remove it without lifting up the lamp to read the instructions. Or you put food in a microwave and don't pour over the manual for 5 minutes because you "know" what to do. Or you know that the pedal on the right is the throttle (in left side operator cars) without needing to look for instructions when you get in a car and when they drive through an area that has the same posted speed forever we proceed as normal unless there is something to call our attention to the change.
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That one, at least, is a bad choice of example when trying to illustrate your point: left pedal brake, right pedal throttle is a requirement of Federal law, and has been for many years. It's not something that manufacturers could suddenly change on a whim.
--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)
  Click to see the full signature.
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re: Your claim was that it wasn't dishonest to shrink packages because people could read the labels
And I will continue to claim it isn't dishonest. What isn't true? Is the container labled with a weight that differs from the actual weight? Does it ring up at the register differently than the price on the sign? Does it not contain the product that it says it does? Where's the lie?
Deviation from the norm is not dishonest. Deviation from the norm is called change - sometimes for the better, sometimes not, and sometimes it really makes no difference at all.
It was once the norm that women and certain minorities could not vote. Then we "deviated" and things got better.
It was once the norm that teachers could take certain actions when a student disrupted the class enough that the other students couldn't learn. Then we "deviated" and things got wor - errrr - things changed. (I'll leave that discussion for another thread.)
re: Once people have learned something we don't examine the minutia each time and just go on with life.
Being observant is not the same things as examining the minutia. What I get for my hard earned money is very important to me, so while I'm pretty sure that the power level of my microwave isn't going to change each time I use it, I can't be as confident about the price and/or quality of my purchases. Therefore I stay observant when I shop. I compare the unit prices, I carefully examine any package that says "new and improved" - basically I'm careful that I don't get "fooled" by gimicky marketing strategies.
re: So when we buy the "gallon" ice cream we reach for the package that has always represented a gallon.
Pop quiz: What company registered the slogan "An educated consumer is our best customer"?
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Pop quiz: What company registered the slogan "An educated consumer is our best customer"?
Syms used that line.
While making packages smaller is perfectly legal, the purpose behind it is still to deceive the customer rather than raise prices.
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re: Syms used that line.
Still does. http://www.syms.com /
re: While making packages smaller is perfectly legal, the purpose behind it is still to deceive the customer...
I guess companies that do that don't believe that "An educated consumer is our best customer". Pop Quiz II: Name 2 ways to keep from being deceived. Hint: Look between the quotes for one answer.
re: ...rather than raise prices.
But they did raise prices - they raised the unit prices - which is the only way to compare prices between otherwise similiar products.
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re: ...rather than raise prices.
But they did raise prices - they raised the unit prices - which is the only way to compare prices between otherwise similiar products.
************************
That should have been followed with "on the standard sized package"
If a half gallon container was good for 90 years or so, there is no logical reason that changing the size is better. Certain commodities in the store have been sold by the pint, quart, pound, dozen, for ages and fluffing up products in the same sized can at lower count is a marketing ploy
There are countless people that make bad assumptions. Such as Home Depot has the best prices on home repair products. Or that they have a large selection. Of that Best Buy is a great place to buy an appliance. At one time, there was some truth to that. I'd drive 30 miles to a big box store or discounter and save $100 over the local guy. The local guy got smart and figured out how to sell at the same price and offer better service.
Today, my wife want to go to Lumber Liquidators to look at flooring. Her perception was that they would have good flooring at cheap prices. They don't. Instead, I went to a local store less than a half mile from my house and got a deal that no big box store or internet sell could match. .
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re: That should have been followed with "on the standard sized package"
What? You really gotta explain that one. I'm not even going to hazard a guess as to what you are trying to say.
re: If a half gallon container was good for 90 years or so, there is no logical reason that changing the size is better.
Where in the previous 138 messages in this thread has anybody said it was "better"?
re: (changing sizes) "is a marketing ploy"
I think we've all agreed to that...numerous times.
re: Home Depot, Best Buy, local retailers and Lumber Liquidators
Nice stories. Thanks for sharing. What have they got to do with companies trying to hide price increases by making the package smaller? My God...they haven't shortened the 8 foot 2 x 4, have they?
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