What is the logic of banging DOWN on a crankshaft to remove a flywheel?

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On 7/13/2010 2:04 AM, James H. wrote:

WRONG WRONG WRONG again. That is NOT what those holes are for.
--
Steve Barker
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So you "ham handed" your engine and now want to tell all the engine techs out that that have done it for about 100 years it doesn't work. See anything odd about that?
Harry K
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BTW if those holes were "designed to be tapped 1/4 x 20" they would have come from the factory that way.
Harry K
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On Mon, 12 Jul 2010 21:29:02 -0700 (PDT), Harry K wrote:

Hi Harry, I appreciate your input. I can't say why the factory doesn't tap those holes, but, they have arrows and something like the words "tap here" on them and all the Briggs and Stratton instrucions say to tap them, so, it's pretty clear what to do (once you know the answer).
I suspect the reason they don't tap them ahead of time is pure cost; albeit it can't cost a lot.
See these references, all of which say to tap the holes when pulling the flywheel on a Briggs and Stratton engine:
http://engines.myfaqcenter.com/Answer.aspx?p_faqid422 http://outdoorpowerinfo.com/repairs/flywheel_removal.asp http://www.repairfaq.org/samnew/lmfaq/lmflyrml.htm http://www.ehow.com/way_5655790_briggs-stratton-flywheel-removal.html
etc.
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On Mon, 12 Jul 2010 21:29:02 -0700 (PDT), Harry K

Those holes are used during manufacture for alignment pins.
Know how they remove a flywheel at the B&S factory? Yep. Prybar and a hammer. That's standard procedure.
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I disagree with this. Some things are built with marks or pilot holes so the technician knows where to drill for maintenance.
A perfect example are the 3 dimples that Ford puts in their doors so the tech will know where to drill the holes to gain access to the three screws that holds the power window motor in place.
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Um, yes, yes it is.
Nearly every household in America has a hammer and a screwdriver of some sort.
Few households have "harmonic balancer pullers," a very specialized tool.
If you understand basic physics, the technique is not confusing at all, is very simple, and very effective.
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On Mon, 12 Jul 2010 11:05:38 -0700 (PDT), snipped-for-privacy@rochester.rr.com wrote:

So that makes three (somewhat similar) explanations so far: 1. Vibrations allow the friction to lesson 2. Move the crankshaft down 1/8th of an inch moves the flywheel up 3. Try to move the crankshaft down; it can't; so the flywheel moves up
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Please drop the "move it doen 1/8" inch. I have already told you at least twice that the person who said that was in error. The true distance is a few thousandths.
Harry K
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On Mon, 12 Jul 2010 19:41:36 -0700, Smitty Two

Most of us are betting that nothing will.
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Should read, "What is the logic of prying against your intake manifold"
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On Mon, 12 Jul 2010 13:07:40 -0700 (PDT), JIMMIE wrote:

I don't disagree. :)
I'll have to snap some pictures though, as you'll need to see that if you're going to go 360 degrees around the flywheel, you have to pry on SOMETHING in all directions and the intake manifold was in front, across the entire front of the engine, crossing from the air intake on one side to the valve mechanism on the other side.
Of course, if I knew that dirty gray pipe crossing the front of the engine was brittle plastic, I would have given up on the pry-bar method. Besides, knowing what I know now, nobody in his right mind would pry on anything to get this type of flywheel off.
The right way to do it, I found out belatedly, is to tap the two pre-existing holes with a 1/4x20 tap and simply use a harmonic balancer to lift the flywheel up almost effortlessly. The force is high, but the effort is low due to mechanical leverage.
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James H. wrote:

You don't pry to move the flywheel. You pry to move the crankshaft up a bit to give it room to move down when you tap. Will saying it the second time get it through to you?
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Back to your repeated "because I couldn't do it, everybody who has ever done (and continues to do) it is wrong, wrong, wrong" You have a lot of manuals that you need to start rewriting.
Harry K
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On Mon, 12 Jul 2010 21:37:15 -0700 (PDT), Harry K wrote:

Hi Harry,
It's true I couldn't do it, but PLEASE LOOK at the picture here! (If not for yourself, then for the sake of the next guy that gets the advice to whack the crankshaft.)
Notice, once the flywheel is cleaned and chalked, it clearly has embossed on the face "TO REMOVE, USE WHEEL PULLER HOLES". It has two big arrows pointing to those untapped wheel puller holes.
Pictures here:
http://img708.imageshack.us/g/briggsandstrattonflywhe.jpg/ http://yfrog.com/jobriggsandstrattonflywhej
http://img708.imageshack.us/img708/7369/briggsandstrattonflywhe.jpg
Very many web pages, it turns out, state to tap the holes and use a wheel puller that fits into the holes. Even the Briggs and Stratton web sites and Sears sells the wheel puller that fits into these holes (once tapped).
So all I'm saying, for the next guy, not for me, is: 1. DO NOT bang and pry this type of Briggs & Stratton flywheel 2. The correct approach is to tape two 1/4 x 20 holes & use the Briggs & Stratton or Sears flywheel puller, part number BS 19069.
I thank everyone, yes everyone. Especially since I have NEVER before worked on a lawnmower so I was very clumsy and broke a lot of things. But let's all learn so as not to lead the next guy astray. The way to remove THIS flywheel is not to bang on the crankshaft but to more gently lift up from the pre-drilled un-tapped holes.
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James H. wrote:

Is that like the custard tin lid that I licked the custard off of to find the lettering "Do not lick lid"?
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The fact that you had to drill it for the bolts is worrysome, it wasnt designed to be maintained and now is probably out of balance.
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On Mon, 12 Jul 2010 17:32:53 -0700 (PDT), ransley wrote:

Allow me to clarify. I didn't drill anything. All I did was tap the two pre-drilled holes in the flywheel. They are there, it turns out, expressly for the purpose of removing the flywheel.
Apparently the proper way to remove this type of Briggs and Stratton flywheel is NOT to bang down on the crankshaft while prying up; nor is it to lift up on the edges with a flywheel puller; but it is to lift up from near the center with the two bolts in those pre-drilled holes.
For some reason, Briggs and Stratton prefers us to tap the holes ourselves, which I did with a 1/4 x 20 tap. Once I did that, the flywheel lifted up easily with a harmonic balancer puller.
Point is not many people seem to know this so that's why the word needs to go out that the other methods are deprecated for this type of motor.
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On 7/13/2010 1:14 AM, James H. wrote:

WRONG WRONG WRONG again. That is NOT what those holes are for

WRONG WRONG WRONG again. That is NOT what those holes are for

--
Steve Barker
remove the "not" from my address to email
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On Tue, 13 Jul 2010 09:18:31 -0500, Steve Barker wrote:

I thank everyone for their help but let's not lead the next guy astray please.
In addition to the instructions belatedly found in the Sears and Briggs & Stratton PDFs previously listed, in response to this post, I further cleaned and chalked the flywheel and posted a picture of it here: Direct link:
http://img708.imageshack.us/g/briggsandstrattonflywhe.jpg/ Short link: http://yfrog.com/jobriggsandstrattonflywhejx Web player: http://img708.imageshack.us/slideshow/webplayer.php?id=briggsandstrattonflywhe.jpg
Stamped right on the Briggs & Stratton flywheel are the embossed words: "TO REMOVE, USE WHEEL PULLER HOLES", with arrows pointing to the two holes.
If you don't believe me, please see the photo below (and please let's all agree that the right way to remove THIS flywheel is to tap the holes and pull with the Briggs & Stratton flywheel puller P/N: BS 19069.
http://img708.imageshack.us/img708/7369/briggsandstrattonflywhe.jpg
Thanks again for all the wonderful help!
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