water pipe "upgrade"

Hello all,
House has got a 3/4 copper running from the meter to just a few feet under the crawl space. It then reduced to a 1/2 inch.
Pressure and flow is there but a hair weak when I had more than one faucet running. Is it worth it to upsize the accessible part of the piping with 3/4? Some were ran behind the walls, Don't want to tear out the wall and replace the 1/2 in. behind it.
So, it will end up with 3/4 for most, reduced it to 1/2 just before it disappears behind the walls.
thanks richard
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On 3/17/2013 6:36 PM, snipped-for-privacy@altavista.net wrote:

Richard, have you checked your water pressure? Is the 1/2" pipe copper or galvanized iron? I've seen a number of older homes that had the water line from the meter replaced with a 3/4" copper but hooked into older iron pipe that contained flow restricting deposits. A bit more information about your situation would help and someone here may have replaced their older 1/2" pipe with the more modern PEX tubing and tell you how they did it. ^_^
TDD
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On Mar 17, 8:48 pm, The Daring Dufas <the-daring-du...@stinky- finger.net> wrote:

Service from meter was recently replaced (galvanized to 3/4 copper) - not much pipe left with all the deposit. In the crawl space is where the 1/2 copper lines are (it came that way with the house).
Pressure is good on the 3/4 side or when only 1 faucet is running. A little weak when another is opened.
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On 3/17/2013 9:31 PM, snipped-for-privacy@altavista.net wrote:

Most pressure regulators for home use in The U.S. are factory set to 50psi and can be adjusted up or down as you choose. I always recommend a pressure regulator on domestic potable water supplies to homes and businesses because of the damage pressure spikes can do to the water heater and its TP safety, the toilet float valve and the sink faucets. You didn't mention a pressure regulator or what your actual water pressure happens to be. You can replace the 1/2" copper with PEX tubing which I believe would give you more flow but I'm curious as to what your water pressure is as measured in psi. o_O
http://www.watts.com/pages/_products_details.asp?pidw6
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Watts-3-4-in-Plastic-Water-Pressure-Test-Gauge-DP-IWTG/100175467
http://tinyurl.com/bn8jmnt
TDD
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snipped-for-privacy@altavista.net;3031415 Wrote: > Is it worth it to upsize the accessible part of the piping with 3/4? > Some were ran behind the walls, Don't want to tear out the wall and > replace the 1/2 in. behind it.

Richard:
Can you find the point where the 1/2 inch water supply line under the house separates into two 1/2 inch lines; one supplying cold water to the house and the other supplying water to the water heater?
If so, then I'd replace the 1/2 inch copper pipe up to that branch with 3/4 inch copper pipe. Then, at least, you have full hot water pressure to one fixture or appliance, and full cold water pressure to another fixture or appliance at the same time.
However, as it stands now, that 1/2 inch pipe under your house now is a bottle neck, and it's most of the reason for the lower water pressure whenever any two faucets are opened.
Obviously, a better situation would be to have 3/4 inch copper piping throughout your house, and tap off each supply line with a 3/4 X 3/4 X 1/2 tee at each appliance or plumbing fixture so that any two appliances or plumbing fixtures can have full flow to them at the same time. That way, one person can have a shower without fear of being scalded if someone else flushes a toilet somewhere else in the house.
Redoing the water supply piping with Pex is something I've never done, but I've been told that it's much easier than using rigid copper tubing because the Pex tubing is flexible, so that you can run it around corners instead of having to cut the tubing and use an elbow.
--
nestork


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Bingo. If he can get the 3/4" to where it branches into multiple 1/2", then I think he has a good chance of seeing improvement. Just replacing one section of 1/2" that then has another remaining 1/2" section directly ahead of it isn't likely to make an improvement worth doing.
And as others have said, if there is any galvanized left, that is likely a big part of the problem. As it gets old, it corrodes from the inside and gradually the opening reduces, restricting the flow.....
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On Sun, 17 Mar 2013 17:36:27 -0700 (PDT), snipped-for-privacy@altavista.net wrote in

It won't hurt and can only help. Give it a try.
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the problem is the remaining galvanized , its interior is almost certinally clogged with rust, restricting flow.
when this occurs it starts leaking. I would replace all of it with PEX, its far cheaper than copper...
or you can wait till the flow stops and leaks occur. hopefully they wouldnt do a lot of damage
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Bob,
Fortunately, the only galvanized section left was the one taken out (from meter to about 6 ft in from the foundation wall). I had to, there wasn't much left inside that pipe from all the deposit. Also had a shut-off installed. The old one had one of those with square rod sticking through the woodfloor. That shut-off wouldn't even turn, tried to turn it off once and the rod twisted.
Previous owner had the pipes from that point replaced with 1/2 copper. The plumber that ran the 3/4 from the meter recommended replacing the 1/2 in copper to the point where it enters the bath walls.
I'll check around on PEX.
thanks folks, richard
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snipped-for-privacy@altavista.net wrote:

I read all of the posts on this so far.
Do you mean the 3/4 is visible in the crawl space (and is not "under" the crawl space)?
If so, where is the hot water heater in relation to the 3/4 copper that is in the crawl space?
My thinking is (as others have suggested) that if you can figure out a relatively easy way to get the 3/4 copper supply to the hot water heater, you can make a huge improvement in the water pressure by doing that. The idea is to have 3/4 copper all the way until it splits off to a 1/2 copper to the cold water and a 1/2 copper to the hot water heater.
I may not be describing this very well, but where is the hot water tank in relation to the existing 3/4 copper? Is it easy to get the 3/4 from where it is now to the hot water heater?
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TomR,
Yes, pipes are "in" the crawl space and are visible. Water heater is about 30ft from the 3/4 service (at the point where a reducer was installed). I think I got your idea and will change out as much as I can; other than those behind the walls which would be short runs. Thought about PEX, tools for it are kind of pricey for a one time job.
thanks richard
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snipped-for-privacy@altavista.net wrote:

You can rent the crimping tool(the good one) from HD. That's what I did when I needed it one time. Our house is running at 60 psi water pressure. I had to adjust press. regulator. Incoming pressure is over 80 psi.
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thanks! that'll work
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snipped-for-privacy@altavista.net wrote:

Sounds like you may have a plan that will work.
The key to the plan is that the supply pipe needs to be all 3/4 all the way until it gets to the hot water heater. Any cold water lines can come directly off of the 3/4 line and be 1/2 inch -- that's okay. But there can't be any part where the 3/4 main supply line drops down to 1/2 before it gets to the hot water heater -- except AFTER the last cold water line comes directly off of the 3/4 line. In other words, you can't have anyplace where the main incoming line is 1/2 inch and splits off from the 1/2 inch to one line for the hot and one line for the cold.
It is a little hard to explain, but if there is any portion (even a very short run) of the main incoming supply line that drops down to 1/2 inch before it gets to the hot water heater (after the last cold water line tees off of the 3/4 line), that will defeat the whole effort. So, if you mean that the new 3/4 will go to the wall somewhere, then drop to 1/2 in the wall, then comes back out of the wall someplace else as 1/2 and switches back to 3/4 to go on to the hot water heater, that won't work. It has to be all 3/4 all the way to the hot water heater, but any tees (not 90's) directly off of the 3/4 line can be 1/2 inch.
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Think a nasty busy stretch of road that causes traffic jams
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Tough to tell if it is worth it without knowing the total length involved, length that currently is 3/4", and how much of the 1/2" you can replace with 3/4".
--
Better to be stuck up in a tree than tied to one.

Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar.org
  Click to see the full signature.
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On Mar 18, 6:29 pm, snipped-for-privacy@sdf.lNoOnSePsAtMar.org (Larry W) wrote:
om>,

had a poor flow some years go on a hot line to my bathroom. I have all copper so that wasnt it.
When I finally gott around to fixing it I found it near impossible to close my ball valve hot to the bathroom:(
I ended up sticking a piece of pipe over the end of the ball valve lever and had to rock it to finally close it......
Anyhow when I was done I opened the valve and found gravel came out of my tub spout. Flow was great:)
Conclusion:......
There had been a water line break nearby.....
Gravel got into the line and got stuck at the ball valve, slowing the flow. When I had trouble closing the ball valve it disloged the rocks which came out the tub spout when the water came back on.
If I were the OP I would replace as much as possible the 1/2 line and replace all the valves espiclly if they are the old style which have small passages for the water to pass at the valves
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In article <27087625-320e-41af-acce-5eeab366d185@

Yes, you will get much better flow with 3/4" pipes!
And very good flow to a shower if you don't have a flow restricting shower head/faucet. Especially good if someone turns on a faucet somewhere else while taking a shower. Barely noticed.
But with that said, some faucets only have a 3/8 inch connection like a bathroom faucet. In that case it is better to run the hot water for the faucet 1/2" up to where it connects to another line. Then you will get the hot water sooner (like first thing in the morning).
And then good to run 1" lines outside prior to entering the home - for good flow to garden hoses AND the house. Some city building codes require a 1" main line.
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