Use deep discharge marine battery as emergency power source?

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On Tue, 1 Feb 2011 11:36:40 -0800 (PST), " snipped-for-privacy@aol.com"

Except anything big enough to run the furnace will NOT run on 12 volts. My 1kva units are 36 and 42 volts. I do have an old 1kva inverter from a BELL service truck that runs off 12 volts and has a remote start feature (comes on when the load is switched on)
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On Feb 1, 9:56 pm, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

Hmmm, I thought you were the guy that has the furnace with an ECM blower that only uses as much electricity as a 100W bulb. If that's true, then your furnace should be capable of being run off a UPS connected to a car battery. The blower is the only load that amounts to anything. The inital startup current for a couple seconds will be larger, but still should be within the capability of an inverter powered off a car battery.....
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On Wed, 2 Feb 2011 07:17:55 -0800 (PST), snipped-for-privacy@optonline.net wrote:

Go crawl back under your bridge. Your reading comprehension, as well as your evident technical knowlege are both at about a grade 3 level, but your aggravation factor is over the moon.
The ecm blower in heat mode draws about (up to) 6.5 amps,plus the inducer motor. (that's the numbers from my furnace - your current draw may vary)
Not sure what the hot surface ignitor draws, but that is not an issue because it definitely draws less than the blower, and is never energized when the blower is in the "heat" mode.
If the furnace draws 7.5 amps at 120 volts (nominal) the power draw is 900 watts.. Assuming the inverter is 98% efficient that is a draw of about 76 amps from a 12 volt battery. And getting back to your abysimal reading comprehension, not very many 1kva UPS units, which is what was I was responding to, work off of 12 volts. Any that do are "bottom feeder" models that would not stand up to long-term use at full load.
If you have a AC motor blower the starting current of the blower is generally well over 150% of nameplate current - so let's say you need an "inverter" that can handle 1350 va motor starting power, with a battery current exceding 100 amps on startup. I am not aware of a 1.5kva UPS of any description that uses a 12 volt battery back.
And if you could find such a beast - and one that could run more than 20 minutes or so at full load without overheating, your average automotive battery would be below 80% depth of discharge in significantly under an hour of steady use.
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On Feb 2, 9:58 pm, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

Yeah, forgive me for being confused. You've spent so much time telling us how that wondeful ECM blower runs 24/7 and only draws 100Watts..... I guess you forgot the part where that's only in fan only mode, where the fan barely moves the air. The other part of that 24/7, when the furnace is actually heating, it draws 8 times that. But wait, we're supposed to use a two stage furnace that spends a lot of time on lower output heating so that furnace is firing a lot of the time. Some would say it should be firing all the time during the coldest days. So there goes that miracle ECM blower that only uses 100W, 24/7.

Uh huh, according to you.... Last time I checked the poster was asking about using a simple inverter, not a UPS. A full UPS was never a requirement. But you do have a way of taking threads into your own little world. But even playing by your rules, what's this, which I found in 2 mins with google?
http://www.ecodirect.com/Samlex-TN-1500-112F-1500-Watt-12-Volt-Pure-Sine-p/samlex-tn-1500-112f.htm
Samlex TN-1500-112F, Off Grid Inverter, 1500 Watt, 12 Volt, Pure Sine Wave, w/Solar Charge Controller/AC charger & Transfer Relay for UPS function

Pay attention. He didn't say he wanted to use an auto battery. The question was about using a marine deep cycle battery. And you can get deep cycle batteries that will supply 150AmpHr. Use a couple of them and you have an hour or two of furnace run time. Economical or practical compared to a generator? No. But not totally out of the realm.
I know you think you Canadians are very smart up there. So, I'm sure you'll like this source straight from Canada. They say you can power a furnace with a battery/inverter:
http://www.cmhc-schl.gc.ca/en/co/maho/em/em_002.cfm
1A — Battery backup with inverter/charger for short blackouts of 12 – 48 hours: $2,350 Essential AC loads only. Furnace, sump pump, well pump, fridge, plus efficient lights and small DC appliances.
Again, I'm not saying it's cost effective, or practical. I'd go with a generator. But it shows that once again, contrary to your shoot from the hip comments, it can be done. BTW, have you gone down to the auto parts store to see those batteries with the removable cell caps?
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On Tue, 1 Feb 2011 11:32:46 -0800 (PST), " snipped-for-privacy@aol.com"

And EXTREMELY innefficient - not to mention illegal in many areas. Maximum 3 minutes idle time.
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On Wed, 02 Feb 2011 08:17:37 -0800, Smitty Two

The most compelling reason is COST.
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wrote:

A regular car battery is said to loose 50% of it's lifespan every time it excedes 80% depth of discharge. That means running it dead TWICE cuts it's expected lifetime to 25%.
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I don't know who said that, but it just isn't true. I use a trolling motor on my boat, and have run the battery down to nearly nothing many times. After a trickle charge for a day or two, it is ready to go again and performs as well as before, time and time again, usually for three or four years.
Besides, the OP said a "marine battery", and you said a "car battery". Two related and similar, but slightly different animals.
Bob-tx
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On Tue, 1 Feb 2011 15:01:41 -0600, "Bob-tx" <No Spam no contact> wrote:

No - I was responding to the

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Yeah thought of that
But do they come in capacities capable of running a week with small to moderate loads for lighting and such?
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On Mon, 31 Jan 2011 21:31:35 -0600, snipped-for-privacy@privacy.net wrote:

One thing you can do is to recharge your battery from the car. I did that after hurricane Charley to run a few inverters off of my golf cart. I used the batteries and charged them from the car 2 at a time. Now I have this gadget.
http://gfretwell.com/electrical/redneck_power.jpg
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snipped-for-privacy@privacy.net wrote in wrote:

A whole week? I think a marine battery won't last two days with what you plan to do with it. Think of what happens when you leave your 55W car headlights on overnight.
A generator is probably a better bet for you.
--
Tegger

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lighting would be very high efficiency type... CFL based or LED based only
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On Feb 1, 10:30 am, snipped-for-privacy@privacy.net wrote:

Get a car battery and try it but I still think you will be disapointed. I've seen things as simple as leaving an interior light on overnight drain a battery to where it would no longer start the car. I have a group 29 dual purpose bvattery in my boat just to deal with sitting and running the radio. And I still limit that to a few hours. A group 29 battery weighs about 60lbs.
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On Jan 31, 10:31 pm, snipped-for-privacy@privacy.net wrote:

You ae not going to run anything for a week off of a battery you can carry. Batteries as a backup power source are very limited. Enough lithium batteries to be of any use will cost a small fortune.
If you need a week you need a generator.
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I tend to agree. But, it all depends on what his definition of "small to moderate loads" is. If it's lighting a small 12V lamp for 10 mins at a time a few times a day and charging his cell phone via USB, then it could last more than a week. On the other hand, for most emergency power for home use, you'd want to also run more, like the refrigerator, more lights, possibly the furnace, etc.
I can tell you with my cabin cruiser it had two dual purpose marine batteries and you could pretty much drain them in less than 24 hours of reasonable use. That included just lighting, running the refrigerator bathoom fan, radio, water pump, etc.
He should start by putting together by determining the running current for all the loads and how long they each will be used. Then he'll know the required AmpHours and what size battery range he needs.
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On Mon, 31 Jan 2011 21:31:35 -0600, snipped-for-privacy@privacy.net wrote Re Re: Use deep discharge marine battery as emergency power source?:

Yes, but they get expensive: http://www.tripplite.com/en/products/ups-va-capacity.cfm
--
Work is the curse of the drinking class.

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On Mon, 31 Jan 2011 21:31:35 -0600, snipped-for-privacy@privacy.net wrote:

No, and generally speaking a 80ah battery won't do that either.
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wrote:

Just remember, NOT ALL UPS devices will start without being connected to power. Many will NOT cold start.
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On Jan 30, 11:59 pm, snipped-for-privacy@privacy.net wrote:

Battery MUST be forever on a charger, like a trickle charger but after a few years it will go bad.....
Marine batteries have short lives and short warranties.
Your probably better off to buy a new battery for your vehicle and use the old vehicle battery for your back up needs. this costs less and works well.
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