Toilet Flapper valve

Friend has a perfectly good toilet and all the float and flapper assemblies look good but the flapper often refuses to fall into the socket or whatever it's called after the bowl empties. I can't find any obvious fault with it. Short of replacing it, what other options might work?
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On Wed, 05 Dec 2012 21:05:20 -0800, "Malcom \"Mal\" Reynolds"

I've dealt with toilets like that. After replacing the flapper several times (because sometimes a new one can be defective or dry from shelf life), the only recourse is to replace the entire flush assembly. That includes the part below the flapper (called a seat). This involves removing the tank bolts, taking off the tank, and replacing that part and the tank bolt rubber gaskets.
Before you do that, be sure the flapper is good. Try another brand. Make sure the chain or plastic piece that connects to the handle is not too short or mis-aligned. Also check to be sure there is not some crud on the seat (part that the flapper sits on).
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On Thu, 06 Dec 2012 01:26:02 -0600, snipped-for-privacy@triumph.org wrote:

They make valve seats that "glue" to the old seat. Splitting the toilet can be a big job and may result in a new toilet. Be prepared for work.

Yes, wiping it with a piece of paper towel usually works. Don't flush the paper towel!
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On 7 Dec 2012 01:18:15 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@at.biz wrote:

Having worked as a plumber, I consider this a small job, and no need to buy a new toilet. However for a DIY homeowner, it can be a challenge. One trick I'll share. If the OP does it, put silicone caulk on those round rubber gaskets that bolt the tank to the bowl. Over tightening those bolts could crack the tank, and they always leak if not tightened enough. The silicone always solved it. Also, be sure the tank is VERY clean and totally dry when installing the bolts.
I have never seen glue on valve seats. But it's been over 20 years since I was in business and have not had to fix any of these. Where do they sell them? What kind of glue is used?

However, they can get a buildup of calcium or iron if the water contains it. That may need some fine emory cloth to remove. Another thing, the old brass ones would get pitted. Nothing would fix them except replacement. (or maybe these glue on ones).
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snipped-for-privacy@triumph.org wrote:

It's not a problem of a proper seal when seated, it's a problem of the flapper refusing to drop when the tank empties
I'll probably get a replacement flapper. I do know that the innards were recently replaced but with some off brand, not Kohler replacement parts
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On Fri, 07 Dec 2012 16:09:37 -0800, "Malcom \"Mal\" Reynolds"

There are some better flappers that cost more and have a little more substance to them, thus more weight. Spend the extra $2 and get a good one.
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Make sure you have the correct type installed. Make sure the chain is properly adjusted. Try lengthening or shortening the chain and see if that makes a difference.
Flappers are only a couple of bucks each. If this flapper is old, replace it anyway; it might be warped.
--
Tegger

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On Wednesday, December 5, 2012 11:05:20 PM UTC-6, Malcom Mal Reynolds wrote:

If it "refuses" to fall it is probably hung-up by excess chain. You need just a small amount of slack/play in the chain when closed. It can be the wrong type as Tegger said.
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On Thu, 6 Dec 2012 03:50:09 -0800 (PST), Bob_Villa

They can get hung up on the float, too. I have to replace the valve assembly in the house we're putting on the market, this weekend. I replaced the flapper because it was leaking. It now hangs up on the float every time (it always did, once in a while).
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This one has one of those stack floats and doesn't hang up on it. The chain doesn't appear to be the problem, mostly because it's plastic and floats, although maybe the weight of a metal chain would help.
Anyway, tonite I found a handy wing-nut and twist tied it to the chain as close to the flapper as I could and it now works perfectly.
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Hmm, a fishing weight, repackaged as a flapper weight, and sold for $4.95 on Amazon.
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When it gets stuck, open the tank and look. If you can't tell after examination, your only recourse is replace.
--
Dan Espen

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On Wed, 05 Dec 2012 21:05:20 -0800, "Malcom \"Mal\" Reynolds"

Try a new flapper first. Some manufacturers will even send you one for free if you Email them (Kohler for one) There is also a specific length of chain for optimum performance. My Kohler is 9 links, per Kohler tech support.
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snipped-for-privacy@aol.com wrote:

I've had trouble with those plastic "chains" being too stiff too permit trouble-free flapper operation.
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On Wed, 05 Dec 2012 21:05:20 -0800, "Malcom \"Mal\" Reynolds"

If it's just "slightly" outa alignment, you could try some petroleum jelly to lubricate it and that might work for a while. This trick usually buys me some time to replace my flapper which I just replaced yesterday in one bathroom. Otherwise I agree with the other posters so far.
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On Wed, 05 Dec 2012 21:05:20 -0800, "Malcom \"Mal\" Reynolds"

In lieu of replacing the entire mechanism the home improvement stores sell a new "Seat" which is attached to the existing seat with silicon sealer. Regarding the flapper not closing, it most likely is the chain mechanism and the other posters are correct in that a chain that is too long will cause this issue. Try removing links, one at a time, to see if the issue is resolved. Good luck.
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All flappers are not created equally. The generic fit all flapper is not always dimensionally accurate enough to seat. Spend a little extra money on the OEM part.
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