There used to be a couple of small, old hardware stores around here. One was an Ace and the other a True Value. Both had helpful employees who knew about the products they sell. I would go to one of those stores when I needed help deciding just what part to get. Both stores are out of business now, after Lowes opened.
Mark Lloyd wrote the following:
Don't use True Value and Ace Hardware stores as examples of 'local businesses". They are both franchise stores, doncha know? Maybe local people 'owned' them and they employed local residents, so do the HD and Lowes stores, and they employ more people than those small franchise stores.
Gee, HD and Lowes locally owned. Who knew?
Actually that is proven to be true through years of employer/employee relationships with one big condition. That is once a person achieves a moderate wage allowing them to live additional pay is typically not a motivator. But an "associate" at Home Depot/Wallmart/wherever officially means someone has achieved official poverty status.
And big box places love to tout "see, we aren't a crappy employer...we just built the Smithville store and 999 people showed up looking for work". But that doesn't mean anything. We changed over to a service economy. At one time most store jobs were short term for people on the road to something else. The something else was typically manufacturing but manufacturing has disappeared. So now folks need to depend on retail jobs as a long term job. But there are a lot more people than jobs.
Absolutely.
Big box Home Depot and Lowes are not owned by local folks.
Kurt Ullman wrote the following:
The word 'owned' was meant to include managers.
Not usually, that is what confused me. Managers are usually employees, drones like the rest of them at HD and Lowes. Also, are TV and Ace franchises? I thought they were like HWI (now the Do-It Centers) and were purchasing co-operatives.
Home depot is NOT a Franchise store - at least in Canada. They are ALL Corporate stores. I believe that is true in the USA as well.
There is no "local ownership" involved - while Home Hardware, as an example, is TOTALLY DEALER OWNED.
And the "walmartization" of retail has meant that some 80%+ of retail jobs are PART TIME, with NO BENEFITS. - and close to minimum wage.
The walmartization of the retail, indeed many other forms of commerce, is a direct result of what the market wants. We don't want to pay the extra money for quality or service, so we don't get it. I think Pogo got it right: "We have met the enemy and he is us".
Kurt Ullman wrote the following:
Google - "Ace Hardware franchise" or "True Value franchise". Franchises are wholly dependent on the franchise provider for their goods. They can't buy from other providers. I knew someone who once 'owned', or 'managed', if you will, a Carvel Ice cream store. They were not even allowed to buy their milk from other than the Carvel company. If they ran out of Carvel milk, they wouldn't be allowed to get it from the local grocery store, they would have to close down until they received a Carvel delivery. Every sale that Carvel advertised in the media had to be adhered to in the local franchises, at the expense of those franchise owners. Yeah, Tom was a real f**k.
snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote the following:
I didn't say HD or L was a franchise store. I said AH and TV were franchise stores.
WalMart has, for better or worse depending on your point of view, provided what the public wanted at a price they wanted to pay. They have been successful at what they do which is play on the economies of scale along with the maximum in automation and the minimum in pay. As long as we, the consumer, is happy with the outcome and continue to shop there they will continue to be successful. The same holds for the loss of US manufacturing. The consumer has spoken and they aren't willing to pay additional for US made goods when there is no price or quality benefit to be seen. From the Corporations standpoint, its all about survival and they will do what they have to do in order to survive.
I remember those days too, I also remember seeing people go to those stores to get the help in determining what to then buy at Lowe's or HD.
I wonder why they went out of business.....
On 03 Sep 2010 19:33:42 GMT, Mark Lloyd wrote Re Re: The Home Despot takes a turn for the worse.:
There's still room for a mom/pop hardware store in the right location.
We are a small town (6k pop. within 5 miles radius) that has a Lowes & HD 20 miles west of us and a Lowes 20 miles East of us. About 3 or 4 years ago a mom/pop hardware store opened and has expanded twice since it opened. Prices are higher than the L/HD, but the service/convenience is great.
They will be expanding again in January 2011.
Good for them.
The value in a franchise to two directional. In the case of the Franchise, they are providing a service of group purchasing, shipping, advertising, and in many cases training. The individual franchisee gets those benefits but then must agree to purchase only from the Franchise owner. The benefit to them comes from lower prices for their goods, a recognized name, and advertising. Truely independent operations are often forced to pay more for buying from a distributor than they can sell for.
That seems really harsh but is a case of give and inch and give a mile. If they gave into the get it locally once, they would end up giving in all the time.
The franchise can be a hard way to go with the rules established by some of them. You really must do your homework before taking that plunge.
I agree with Caesar there will always be a need since the BORG only sells the better sellers.
The question is can they find a location where they can make a buck. We are down to about 4 store in a metro area of 300K. Three of those are Ace and I wonder what will happen when corporate is no longer on the hook for the lease. The one independent a true value franchisee is best positioned to survive as I imagine they own the real estate.
IMO, the only way they will survive is to get rid of all the high cost merchandise and concentrate on hardware. A small well stocked hardware store may be able to find a niche in a lower rent, smaller footprint location. Selling it at $2 a pop with a 300% markup might make it possible to survive.
Some tend to be totally absolute and others much different and are more like a co-op.
Some people are really mooches. I often wondered if you took one of those tell me how to do it and I will buy it elsewhere folks and paid them the same way. Say Bob, you are our accountant and all you do is answer questions and tell folks how to do stuff so now you will work for free...
See above..
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