sweating copper

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On 2/8/2012 8:01 AM, The Daring Dufas wrote:

obviously tens of thousands of people grew up in lead soldered copper plumbed houses or STILL live in them. It obviously is not a problem.
--
Steve Barker
remove the "not" from my address to email
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On 02/08/2012 10:44 AM, Steve Barker wrote:

could have been.
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Better that what? I grew up in Philadelphia where tens of thousands of houses had lead pipes and/or lead soldered copper. I never saw a problem from it.
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On 02/08/2012 07:28 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

Better brain function, for instance.
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I'd believe you if it was true. Never saw anyone that was affected. I'm know that people using lead glazed ceramics holding acidic juices have been affected. Never saw any damage from water pipes though.
Then there is all that asbestos . . . . .
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Much ado about nothing?
I agree. In a properly soldered water system, consisting of about 12 fittings with 2 solder joints each, there is MABEE 1 square inch of solder exposed to water. That solder is 37 - 40% lead.
In most water systems (around here anyway, where the water is HARD but not alkaline, ) the solder is coated with a thin mineral deposit within months, which at least partially protects the joint from erosion or leaching.
And Asbestos? Yes - it is definitely a hazard when air-born - but when encapsulated in vinyl, as in TILE????
I worked with asbestos on pretty well a daily basis for over 20 years, as it was used in just about all brakes and clutches back when. Lots of guys blew out the dust - I virtually ALWAYS washed it out with a water hose - no dust. Theshing dirt on the farm did me a lot more damage than the asbestos.
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On 2/8/2012 7:28 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

A lot of Obama voters came from there. ^_^
TDD
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The Daring Dufas posted for all of us...
And I know how to SNIP

They have taken the lead out of my pencil and the lead out of my gas so what is left?
--
Tekkie

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On 2/29/2012 9:49 AM, Tekkie wrote:

The led in yo ass boy! Now get a move on! ^_^
TDD
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You could always chew paint chips, if you get desperate.
Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .
They have taken the lead out of my pencil and the lead out of my gas so what is left?
--
Tekkie



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leach. In soft water or highly alkalyn water it is definitely not a GOOD idea - and with reverse osmosis water definitely a BAD idea.
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About 10 or 15 years ago many water municipal water systems started switching from chlorine to a compound called chloramin. There were known problems with chlorine, including health, environnemtal, and equipment related issues, plus the chloramin compounds are more stable in the water supply than chlorine. Un unknown til recently consequence, however, is that chloramin treated water is more prone to leaching lead out of pipes and soldered pipe joints. This has been confirmed by several studies. You can easily find some simply by googling "chloramin and lead." Some of these studies confirm a higher lead level in children's blood after switching to chloramin, and some claim to show that in newer homes, built after lead and lead solder was banned from use on potable water supplies, the lead levels stayed low even with the switch to chloramin.
I am not qualified to comment on whether these higher lead blood levels are in fact a serious health problem, or still below the safe limit. However, my own city switched to chloramin several years ago, and I would not use lead solder myself on water supplies. It really is not that hard to use many of the lead-free products that are available today, unlike some of the early-to-market lead-free solders from several years ago.
--
There are no stupid questions, but there are lots of stupid answers.

Larry Wasserman - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar. org
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On Wed, 8 Feb 2012 23:50:30 +0000 (UTC), snipped-for-privacy@sdf.lNoOnSePsAtMar.org (Larry W) wrote:

over 90 years as a secondary disinfectant in water systems. It has a longer "half-life" in the system - remaining active much longer than chlorine alone. Free chlorine is more agressive to the lead than Chloramine, but chloramine stays in the system longer, so there is a potential for more lead to end up in the water.
All depends on a lot of conditions.
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snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote in

It is nothing of the sort.
Chloramines are ammonia derivatives, in which one or more hydrogen atoms have been replaced by chlorine atoms.
Stick to subjects you know something about; this isn't one of them.
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On Thu, 9 Feb 2012 02:50:09 +0000 (UTC), Doug Miller

noun any of several compounds containing chlorine and nitrogen; used as an antiseptic in wounds [syn: chloramine]
And I AM correct.
Chloramine(s) Definition: A class of amines, chloramines are produced when ammonia and chlorine (as hypochlorous acid) react with each other.
Chloramine is increasingly used in water treatment plants rather than chlorine, as chloramine is much more stable and will not dissipate from water, ensuring disinfection until it reaches the consumers. In chloramine water treatment, monochloramine (NH2Cl) is formed by adding chlorine and ammonia under controlled conditions. In chlorine water treatment, a combination of inorganic chloramines is formed as disinfection by-products, also referred to as combined chlorine residuals.
Chloramines in air are strong respiratory irritants.
Source: GreenFacts
You want to argue with that, fine. Doesn't make you right and me wrong.
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On Feb 8, 11:35pm, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

Yeah, you're correct. Following your chemistry, then water is basically a mixture of hydrogen and oxygen. Or salt water is basically a mixture of hydrochloric acid and sodium hydroxide.

He wasn't aruing with any of that. Only with you referring to a new chemical MOLECULE as a mixture. Capiche?
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snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote in

No, you're not.

That's not at all the same thing as "a mixture of" the two.
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On Thu, 9 Feb 2012 14:59:02 +0000 (UTC), Doug Miller

the reaction.
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snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote in

You don't seem to know any more about chemistry than you do about plumbing.
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On Fri, 10 Feb 2012 02:06:45 +0000 (UTC), Doug Miller

First google result for mix chlorine and ammonia pops up http://chemistry.about.com/od/toxicchemicals/a/Mixing-Bleach-And-Ammonia.htm .
Which says: Mixing bleach and ammonia is extremely dangerous, since toxic vapors will be produced. The primary toxic chemical formed by the reaction is chloramine vapor, with a potential for hydrazine formation. Here's a look at the chemical reactions involved in mixing bleach and ammonia, as well as some first aid advice if you accidentally become exposed to a bleach and ammonia mixture.
You want to argue with that, go ahead and show everyone how stupid you really are. Egotistical know-it-all ASS.
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