Solder or crimp ??

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On 12/29/2013 10:14 AM, philo wrote:

If I flame you, would that return us to normal usenet mode?
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On 12/29/2013 09:21 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Flame your Anderson connector.
btw: what's the ampere rating?
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On 12/29/2013 10:33 AM, philo wrote:

Don't have one. I do crimps for heating and AC work. So terminals for .250 push ons, about as big as I get. Usually 16 gage stranded.
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On 12/29/2013 09:41 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Oh, we just used those for auxiliary contacts, I usually worked with the 350AMP connectors where heating could be significant.
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When soldering was mentioned, I was thinking for around # 12 wire or smaller. I worked around everything from very small wire around # 26 to some of the 000 sizes. Never soldered anything. Had to use some hydraulic crimping tools on the larger stuff. Hand tools just would not do a good job. I doubt anyone would think of soldering the wires that are over 1/4 of an inch or larger. There were some ground wires that were cadwelded, but I don't count that as solder.
The place I worked for had thousands (maybe millions) of crimped or wire nut connections. Almost never saw a crimp fail except when some dummy tried to crimp solid wire. A few wire nut connections failed, but I suspect they were not put on correcctly.
At one time around the house I did solder some of the molex connectors that used from # 24 to # 12 wire. Not that I wanted to, but because I did not have the proper crimp tool. Now I have the tools, I don't solder.
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On 12/29/2013 10:33 AM, Ralph Mowery wrote:

I quit soldering connections in the late 70's
In the 30 years I was crimping there were no problems. (Other than my very first time.)
OTOH: Guys in the shop sometimes soldered and got the contacts contaminated...and the connector would eventually melt due to the heat.
The only time we used a foot-operated hydraulic crimper was in a nuclear power plant when we used 300mcm cables.
Normally 4/0 was the max. we'd deal with.
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On 12/29/2013 10:33 AM, Ralph Mowery wrote:

The larger crimp connectors I've used on power cables have grease in them to fight corrosion. Of course they are cu/al rated and the grease in the connectors is oxide inhibiting compound for the aluminum wire but it also helps the copper wire connections. ^_^
TDD
TDD
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On 12/29/2013 6:21 PM, The Daring Dufas wrote:

Years ago, I did use NoAlOx, on a thermostat. With .250 push on terminals. I came back a couple months later, the terminals had corroded and were useless. Changed to dielectric grease. That seemed to work better. Not sure what it is, with the grey stuff in the squirt tube.
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On Mon, 30 Dec 2013 00:33:25 -0500, Stormin Mormon

NoAlOx is for ALUMINUM connections, not tinned prass (or bare brass either)
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On 12/29/2013 7:42 AM, philo wrote:

That's why I use low temperature silver solder and clean any flux off afterwards even if it's noncorrosive flux. ^_^
TDD
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When I had a chevy cavalier, I had to redo the multiple crimped connector under the battery holder. Soldered or crimped, it's a manufacturer FAULT to put connections under batteries. Do they HEAR me ????
Greg
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On 12/29/2013 10:25 PM, gregz wrote:

My parents had a Chrysler Imperial LeBaron. We finally found the problem, it would go dead at random moments. The problem was the bullet connectors, to the fusible links, near the battery. Dad would get out and wiggle them, and the car would then start up and be fine for a while
In the early 1970's, the made for TV show, Emergency! had a similar problem with the squad truck, I think the episode was called "Breakdown". Wish I could go back and tell them, then, what the problem likely was.
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I can't add much to what others have said comparing general crimp to solder. But lets get back to the question about Anderson Power Pole terminals. I use them extensively with my Ham equipment, operating from 13.8 volt DC power supplies and auto electrical systems.
I've found that Anderson Power Pole connections get hot from contact resistance when they carry high current, say 20 Amps or so continuous. If they are soldered, I do not believe the temperature would be so high that the solder could melt. However the higher temperature might tend to cause oxidation of the solder.
Fred
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On 12/29/2013 05:38 PM, Fred McKenzie wrote:

The problem with lead/tin solder is that it is not a great conductor. A good crimp puts the wire in direct contact with the silver plating of the contact.
Silver solder might be a lot better, but for the 350amp contacts we used, the cost would be prohibitive. (Even lead/tin solder in the quantities we would have needed would have been expensive.)
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On 12/29/2013 7:03 PM, philo wrote:

What job or project was that? How many quantities?
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On 12/29/2013 11:29 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Since I was in the industrial battery business I'd replace or install close to 1000 connectors a year. Since Enersys itself is a world wide company they used hundreds of thousands of connectors a year...more than likely , over a million.
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On 12/30/2013 8:30 AM, philo wrote:

Working on that scale, I can imagine the solder, torch, power for the soldering iron and so on. That would add up after a while. I do a couple dozen crimps a year, and max of 15 amp rating or so. For me to get out a torch and some silver solder is no big expense.
Thanks for sharing a bit more about the, uh, "big picture" of what you were doing.
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On 12/30/2013 07:53 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Sure thing...plus for low current I don't think solder vs crimp is going to make much difference.
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On 12/30/2013 6:35 PM, philo wrote:

When I was a toddler, I lived in a wooden crib with plastic covers on the rails. Makes me wonder if some kind of plastic cover can be made for high potential bus bars? Could be either cut to length, or some thing. Would make the setup less likely to attract metal tools.
Since the bars are a predictable size, a plastic cover could be snapped on.
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On 12/30/2013 06:39 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Insulated "shrouds" are now used on all industrial batteries (forklift)...but they weren't many years ago.
OTOH: Stationary batteries AFAIK do not have them...and now that you mention it, would be a darn good idea.
Of course no one but trained personnel would normally be allowed near a stationary battery setup and with a motive power (forklift) battery...access would not be restricted.
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