Solar water heating system..

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Shade at noon? That seems to expose a lot of afternoon sun. Shade at 2pm? What shade times do you have?
Maybe that cuts down on the winter solar heating. It doesn't seem to. Winter Solstice is only 27 degrees for me.
I can't plant shade trees because of the layout of the house, but I could get away with some pergola, which would look good across the deck, and only nominally out of place across the front door, where my wife wants some more overhang anyway.
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Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley Lake, CA, USA GPS: 38.8,-122.5
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snipped-for-privacy@XReXXSolar.usenet.us.com wrote

Nope, at any time of day.

No sun at any time of the day in summer.

No it doesnt.

Yeah, I deliberately ensured that the layout of the house would allow that.

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That would be a long eave for me. Actually, not possible, as the sun is visible down to the horizon in the afternoon. It's 6:30PDT, and the sun is still shining on the house at 1.1 degrees, according to SunCalc.

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snipped-for-privacy@XReXXSolar.usenet.us.com wrote

6' is fine here, with the glass going down to floor level.

Its gone well past W by then here, so you still dont get any sun thru the N glass.
Most dont realise how far S the sun gets in summer, and I didnt either until I calculated it when designing everything.
I in fact get some sun thru the S glass in summer, very late in the day, just before sunset, but there is a dense run of trees running right along the S side of the house with vegetation down to the ground that means there isnt any heat.
The trees were deliberately designed to produce that effect.

See above.

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I've paid more attention to a lot about the sun motion since I started looking at solar. I would incorporate some of it if I were building a house, but there's not a lot to be done about the existing house.
I thought about azimuth as I looked out the window at the setting sun, after making that posting. At the elevation of 1.1, it's also at azimuth 300. That's still shining some light on my house, facing at a 215 azimuth. One of the pages suggests that extending the eaves isn't a practical solution for houses more than 30 degrees off due south.
At 3:42 pm, the temp was 107F today. The sun was at 54 el, 255 az. Presuming that I want to keep that light off the windows, I would need a 4 foot eave.
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snipped-for-privacy@XReXXSolar.usenet.us.com wrote

Yeah, thats what I meant in my original, by far the best time to do it.

You can do addon solar air heaters, particularly if you are there when the sun is shining much.
The economics and practicality of the more gung ho stuff like attempting to store that solar gain in water etc is a lot more marginal.

Yeah, thats the main thing I did design wise, chose the block so that the house could be long in the EW direction and due N etc.
I chose the block so that it faces into a park right down the S side too, so the council mows it with a full tractor mower and it feels like that is part of the house. The big line of dense trees completely covers the ground in leaf litter, so no maintenance at all is required.

We do usually get at least one burst of 10 days over 100F most summers. It can be like walking into an oven some days.
Very dry tho, 5% is typical so swamp coolers cost peanuts to run.
I almost never have the cooler on after sundown, open all the doors up and let the outside air in.
Only ever have the cooler on overnight maybe one night a year at most.

Yeah, and thats very viable light wise. My 6' eave at 9' off the ground is fine, the main room with 3 8'x8' patio doors on the N is very bright in winter, so bright you need to ensure that the monitors and TVs etc have antiglare screens etc.
It was plenty light enough today which unusually had fog till about 10am and then heavy overcast till about lunchtime. We just had half an inch of rain yesterday, and the room was plenty bright enough yesterday too.
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Derek Broughton wrote:

My garage sits facing almost due west. metal door, the garage temp shoots thru the top in summer
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snipped-for-privacy@XReXXSolar.usenet.us.com wrote:

Those are still the cost to the individual.

Like I thought, that 30c is utterly bogus.

Plenty for off peak hot water.

Yes, and FOR THE OP, ITS HIS ELECTRICITY COST THAT MATTERS.
Not yours or mine.

And I said that FOR THE OP, ITS UNLIKELY TO BE ECONOMICALLY VIABLE TO GO SOLAR.

Yeah, thats pretty much what mine is at the E and W ends of the N wall. There's a section in the middle which has normal wall, with two normal windows in the kitchen area of the two main rooms, and the N bathroom, but its mostly glass otherwise.

Mine is that on the S side, that side has a public park.

Yeah, I have no windows at all on the E and W sides.

Yeah, mine's a flat roof.

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Rod Speed wrote:

I beg to differ. It's not hard to generate enough hot water to pay for a DHW system in reduced electric costs. Pay back for my system vs. electricity would be about 100 months. Not great, but I know many systems running over 10 years with no capital additions, so it's workable. Since I'm not _on_ grid, and use propane for hot water, payback is quicker.
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You have to get down on your knees to beg properly.

Dont believe it when its calculated properly.

Dont believe it, show the numbers.

Nope, not when its calculated properly.

Sure, thats why I said what I said about mains power.
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Rod Speed wrote:

Where are yours?
$30 MINIMUM per month for electric hot water heating at my home. $3000, installed, for a complete solar DHW system.

Show me the numbers.

No, you said it wasn't workable with mains power. I just said it's even faster when off-grid.
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You need that anyway, you cant use pure solar almost anywhere.

I just replaced my storage hot water system after 30 years for $500

You didnt.

No I didnt. I said it wasnt usually GOOD VALUE.

You also claimed that its viable on grid too.
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wrote:

how about the old reliable "batch" or "bread box" style solar heater? http://www.motherearthnews.com/top_articles/1984_January_February/Build_an_Integral_Passive_Solar_Water_Heater http://tva.apogee.net/res/rewhsba.asp http://www.motherearthnews.com/Green_Home_Building/1980_November_December/A__65_Solar_Water_Heater http://www.solarnet.org/SolarHWH.htm http://rise.org.au/reslab/resfiles/lowtemp/text.html
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