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[3ndy]

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[terry]

But so many unanswered questions!!!!!!

1) Living where there is sufficient sun? How many days per year? 2) Cost of batteries to store power during day for use at night etc.? 3) First cost of solar cells? Even if at one dollar per watt probably a first cost of $3000 or so? If solar cells cost five dollars per watt then $15,000? 4) If self installing; cost of inverter to turn battery electrcity into usable AC 'mains type' electrcity? 5) other costs, wiring etc. 6) If planning to sell surplus power, produced by solar, back into local electricity grid; what rate will power utility pay. 7) One estimate; to produce any appreciable amount of power in a suitable climate ranged upward from $10,000?

A local ad. here showed an 180 watt solar panel selling for $800, on sale. Since it s frequently cloudy here that might produce, say 90 watts-per hour, during the day, some days. That's not enough to warrant large expenditures. For each $1000 of outlay, one can buy a third or more of a year's electricity and that includes heating of this all-electric four bedroom home in a cool climate with a long winter.

Contrary opinions welcomed.

[trader4]

A 6KW system for a home costs about $48K. This means that it is totally unviable compared to other electricity generation options. The only way it becomes viable is for the govt to hand out more money to get you to install one. After the gov pays for around half of the cost, then it can make economic sense for the homeowner. For the taxpayers, it's a loser.

[RBM]

A 6KW system for a home costs about $48K. This means that it is totally unviable compared to other electricity generation options. The only way it becomes viable is for the govt to hand out more money to get you to install one. After the gov pays for around half of the cost, then it can make economic sense for the homeowner. For the taxpayers, it's a loser.

In general, people aren't stupid. If solar energy was cost effective, we'd all be tripping over each other to get it.

[salty]

It's very cost effective on my boat!

I'll bet there are lots of other places where it is cost effective.

[RBM]

My point exactly, in the scheme of electrical usage, your boat isn't even on the meter

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[salty]

There are many places where power lines don't reach.

[HeyBub]

It's not just "cost effective," it's generally impossible.

The amount of radiant energy falling on the earth is 120 watts/sq meter. At the equator. At noon. With no clouds. Adjusting for latitude, 12 hours of darkness, clouds, and time of day, one would average about 1/3 the maximum, or 40 watts/sq meter. An 1800 sq ft house would capture, then, (assuming 70% efficiency of the solar collector) 560 watts, or about 1/2 kw.

That's enough for one light bulb (non-CFL), and one TV or one computer. Forget about the fridge.

You can nibble at the margins, but you can't run this country - or an average house - off of sunbeams, irrespective of the cost.

[salty]

Yet, people somehow are able to do it, even though you say it can't be done.

Also take into account that people who do this, are likely very interested in the subject of alternative energy, and may have taken other measures to both conserve and produce power. Solar works quite well for heating water in many places. Another really impressive technology that DOES have a reasonably good ROI despite high initial cost, is geo-thermal.

Photo-voltaic's don't have to be a complete solution in order to be a worthwhile proposition. What's the ROI on your car? Is it at least the most cost efficient car you could possibly own? Is it as cheap as taking mass transit? If not, then I guess using a car for transportation isn't economically feasible.

[keith]

1000W/sq meter

You'd do good at 20% conversion efficiency and 1/3 is optimistic.

Some have no choice (built off grid) and fools live everywhere.

The ROI on my car is quite good, actually (something like 2,500%). It allows me to go to work every day.

[salty]

You just failed basic economics - Very badly.

[JIMMIE]

[gnu / linux]

Wonder if solar is too expensive for the W.Va. coal miners ?

[JIMMIE]

Photovoltaics suck for the average home. On the other hand solar powered water heater and direct heating of your home with solar energy can be very efficient. One study on using photo cells to power a home failed miserably. Trees had to be cut away so light could get to the solar panels. This increased HVAC usage by more than the solar panels could provide. Im not sure which university performed this test but it was in Fl. Shouldn't be hard to find if you want to look it up.

Jimmie

[salty]

I think you just made that up.

[keith]

The fact that you would say this, while unsurprising, shows how dumb you really are.

[salty]

Spoken like a true imbecile. Please continue. I'm here for he entertainment, however low-brow. :-)

[trader4]

That is true. Something has to be wrong with the math, because you can indeed buy a sytem in the 6KW range and put it on an average house roof. It doesn't even cover anywhere near the whole roof, maybe 40% or so I'd say. 6KW is an order of magnitude more than HB's claimed

1/2 KW.

The analogy here would be paying $50K for a car that has the same performance, size, and features as a toyota corolla. There are some applications where it is cost effective to use solar electric because there is no grid. But what we're talking about here is the 95% installed in populated areas with the rest of the taxpayers and future taxpayers getting stuck with paying the extra $25K bill.

[Existential Angst]

Methinks you left off a zero: Should be 1200 W/m^2. Nominal 100 W/sq ft.

Ackshooly, it varies from 900 to 1500 W/m^2, depending on lattitude, altitude, etc.

Selective-surface collectors can substantially exceed 70% -- good mostly for HW (heat, domestic), which can be a big % of used juice. Also, these collectors are proly a lot cheaper than photovoltaics. You can make pretty good ones DIY, as well.

PV's are up to what, now, 15% efficiency?? And I thought I read somewhere that PV's could be had for about $1/watt???

Also, I wonder what the lifespan of PV's are.

[RBM]

And for those that need real electricity in those locations, God created diesel generators

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