shop heat

I know shop heat has been discussed, but I'm finally able to get out of the small basement room and build a shop aprox 24x36 with a basement slab downstairs for car/atv work and a full upstairs for woodworking. I'm digging out tons of dirt now. It's on a sloped lot, so both will walk out to ground level. I'm debating ideas of layout and heat. I'd like to have some HVAC or fan sytem so that it is usable in the summer and winter. I'm thinking of installing in-slab tubing and a small woodstove in the basement and fans and/or AC upstairs. Insulation of course. I've only used a portable propane heater before. I would appreciate any details of installing a minimum cost water heating system to just take the cold edge off the slab in the winter. Can I just use a std water heater & small circ pump? What about keeping the air out of the tubing? Plumbing & manifold details? No one really does this down here. I have 500' of PEX available. Any recommendations on a small wood stove? Should I completely avoid this in an area with cars? Maybe just install a heat pump with little or no ductwork? Located in Knox TN, so it is not a brutal winter, but can be very humid in the summer. I'm also thinking of installing 5" or 6" pipe in the trusses between the floors for a minimal DC system upstairs. I've never seen this done. DC lines always run overhead. Cost is always a concern. Any ideas appreciated. Thx
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On 25 Aug 2003 09:43:43 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@hotmail.com (c) wrote:

Use a hydronic heating system for both floors. Get a boiler suitable for that, and your potable hot water supply.
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Yes to hydronics. It's a radiant heat, which seems more comfortable than forced air - warms the objects directly, rather than using air to heat them up. I would, however, not use the same water system for the heating as you have for your potable water - make the heating loop a closed-loop system, it simplifies the plumbing. Look into using a water heater for the hydronics if your capacity numbers work out, they're less work than keeping a boiler happy.
Dave Hinz
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I live in Fargo, ND and floor heat here is nice. In your area I think it would be over kill! If you want heat in the winter and AC in the summer I would go with a heat pump, they are a perfect match for your climate. Greg
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snipped-for-privacy@hotmail.com (c) wrote in message

I have the arrangement you are considering. Garage on first floor and wood shop in loft above. The second level floor is constructed of Tru Joist I beams and a one ince thick oriented strand (OSB) floor. I installed dust collector outlets for my table saw and a floor sweep in the floor (fitting the tubing between the joists). I also installed the electrical supply to the table saw in the floor. Just remember that for fire protection purposes you will have to sheetrock the garage ceiling. So plan your installation in advance. You may want to fit a soffit across the first floor ceiling to allow for snaking additional floor runs of dust collector tubing. Or you can always cut the sheetrock and patch it. I also have dust collector pickups hanging from the ceiling (piping in the attic). These work well for connecting sanders, the planer and a second dust pickup on the blade guard of the table saw.
I heavily insulated the shop walls and roof. Even up north (Philadelphia area) in the winter the shop reaches a comfortable temperature when heated by the lights, motors, dust collector and air filter. I use a 1200 watt portable (oil filled) electric heater to warm it up at the start of the day. In the summer the afternoon sun does make it too hot to work there for long past 4 PM. I am considering a small air conditioner. Remember that you need to return the dust collector outlet to the shop otherwise your heating and cooling costs will skyrocket. A cylcone located in the garage with tubular outlet filters in the shop would be perfect.
When I moved in I debated what to put on the floor. SWMBO suggested just paint the OSB floor as it would be non slip as is. Three years later and she is still right.
Howard
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There is no real reason a dust collection system can't be put in the floor, but there are a few down sides to it that you need to consider in setting up your system: 1. When you reorganize your shop (note I did not say if) and relocate equipment it will be more difficult to move the DC outlet. 2. You will be left with holes in the floor. 3. You will be taking conditioned air out of your shop with the DC system so your heating and cooling costs will be higher unless you return that air to the shop.
I made a DC system using a 2' x 2' drop box with a Dayton blower on top exhausting into a bag filter on top of a galvanized garbage can. It worked well, you could hear chunks of wood hit the baffle in the drop box, and sand paper would be sucked up if pieces were left on the lathe. I just have to get it set up in my new shop.
Woodcraft supply has an article on their web site about using PVC piping for dust collection - take a look.
Blast gates are down in price and they increase the efficiency of a DC system, plan on getting them. In my system I used microswitches at each blast gate to turn on the blower. I used a furnace relay to provide low voltage to the microswitches which then controlled the blower.
c wrote:

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You might want to do a little research before putting your shop on the second floor. I have heard repeatedly that all stationary power tools work best with lots of weight and sitting on concrete. A friend of mine once had his Woodfast lathe in a second floor room of his house. After about a year, cracks started appearing in walls. A building inspector told him the vibrations were damaging the structural integrity of his house.
-mike paulson, fort collins, co
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