Shocked!

Page 2 of 11  


Some equipment will have some low value capacitors going from the AC wiring to the chassie. This creats a low value of leakage curent. If the equipment has the proper 3 wire plug , there is no problem. Without the ground wire, you could feel a tingle if you got between the device and ground.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload


wiring

Thanks. I have noticed some stereo/radio equipment will have neon pilot lights that take a few seconds to extinguish after the power cord is unplugged so I assume that's some sort of capacitor discharge occurring. I would imagine that to receive a UL listing the equipment can't present any sort of real shock hazard in that state - just a tingle as the residual charge dissipates.
--
Bobby G.




Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
<stuff snipped>

Not sure if that's going to work if the ground is energized. There's also the problem of phantom voltage readings if he's using a digital meter that might make the readings meaningless. I've been researching this problem on the net out of curiousity and there are lots and lots of potential causes. So many that it's a problem best left to a licensed professional.
The copper supply piping may have once been connected to a ground but a repair with a plastic union of some sort has isolated a section of the pipe which is touching something electrical and is now energized. Since there are so many possibilities, it's time for Fred, the OP, to call in the cavalry now that we know it's not a simple static shock.

I agree that the OP should be tracing the pipes *visually* to locate possible contact points, clamps with wires leading from them and places where there might be a plastic union, but it's a serious enough problem to defer to an electrician that has experience with such issues.

I suspect that's going to be part of the solution a qualified sparky will recommend. Something's rotten in Denmark, and it could be more than one problem which makes it really hard for a homeowner to isolate and fix. I say Fred's exceptionally lucky he detected this problem before he stepped into what might have been his last shower on Earth. (-:
--
Bobby G.



Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Mon, 28 Oct 2013 04:08:32 -0400, "Robert Green"

When I installed my new water softener I had to connect a bonding wire between the inlet and outlet of the softener too - it was in the instructions - because the softener meter-head is composite instead of brass.
The water heater has anti-dialectric bushings too - so a jumper across the water heater maintains ground continuity there as well.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
<stuff snipped>

This is what an electrician or an experienced DIY might do, but I am not sure I would recommend such a procedure to a person whose electrical smarts are unknown. Even for a moderately experienced person this could prove a difficult case to diagnose because the rules turn upside down when your typical ground conductor is somehow energized. Where does the other lead of your voltmeter go? Is it a reliable test point?
Turns out this troll bait is a great teaching moment for people who want to learn more. I bought the meter that you recommended. Now the question is how best to test it on deliberately created "faults" so that I become familiar with its operation and how to interpret the beeping patterns and set the sensitivity dial.
I am not sure I want to try energizing the water pipes but it would be nice to be able to detect even low voltage levels on a water pipe. Not even sure how I would inject a voltage from a doorbell transformer onto the pipes without popping a breaker.

This is actually the way a skilled person would diagnose the problem. In the programming world the process is called "grunt and crank" as you step through each possible case. The trick is how to read voltage on the pipes and that little Sperry tester looks like an ideal tool for that job. Good find.

Now if you could only figure out a way to make sure we don't get trolled again. (-: I'd like to drive some rods - vampire movie style.
--
Bobby G.



Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 10/27/2013 3:19 PM, Bill wrote:

I'd think more like neutral to the plumbing.
--
.
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
  Click to see the full signature.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
<stuff snipped>

Congratulations! Yours is the second right answer (get a professional) had this been an actual situation with human life at risk instead of dumb-ass troll attack. If we don't know anything about the OP's skill level, with electrical work it's better to underestimate it.
--
Bobby G.




Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 10/27/2013 01:57 PM, Fred wrote:

!!!I TOLD YOU TO GET A QUALIFIED ELECTRICIAN IN ASAP
EVEN 115V CAN BE FATAL!!!!!
--

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MS85KjUsEm0&feature=youtu.be


Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Agreed. Even less voltage than that can be fatal!
http://www.mikeholt.com/mojonewsarchive/GB-HTML/HTML/Neutral-to-GroundConnections~20020521.htm that says that "Death from an electric shock (ventricular fibrillation*) can occur when the touch voltage is above 30V RMS resulting in as little as 30 milliamperes of current flowing though the body. This can occur when improper neutral-to-case connections are made and the neutral is opened."
--
Bobby G.



Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 11/11/13 4:57 PM, Robert Green wrote:

I like that Mike Holt site. I needed information a couple times for my work. It explained things plainly.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

http://www.mikeholt.com/mojonewsarchive/GB-HTML/HTML/Neutral-to-GroundConnections~20020521.htm

can

30

opened."

Yes, agree. It's not just Mike writing, either, but a whole team of electricians with knowledge it a lot of different areas. They always provide plenty of background information and NEC citations to explain what they're talking about. I invariably end up reading a lot more than what I came to the site to look for because it's so well-written and interesting.
--
Bobby G.



Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Quit posting on Usenet, and call an electrician NOW before someone gets a fatal shock.
Like I told you in my response to your first post, you have a fault in your electrical system that is energizing your water pipes -- *and* the pipes are not properly grounded.
You NEED an electrician, and you need one YESTERDAY. This is potentially DEADLY.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload


I got a call in to an electrician, they will be out Wednesday. Now you're making me nervous if I should even use the shower tonight or not.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 10/27/2013 04:12 PM, Fred wrote:

DO NOT use your shower why risk your life?
I'd spend the extra money and get an electrician in tomorrow .
SERIOUSLY this could be lethal, no one here is trying to scare you unnecessarily.
--

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MS85KjUsEm0&feature=youtu.be


Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 10/27/2013 5:12 PM, Fred wrote:

I vote no. Why risk further shocks?
--
.
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
  Click to see the full signature.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Do you feel lucky?
NO, you should not. It might be the last shower you ever take.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload


you're

Agreed. Now that we know a little more about the situation, if the supply pipes are energized and they are not grounded it's very likely the drain pipe IS grounded and taking a shower will complete the circuit to ground. Through you.
If you can't get an electrician in on Monday I would consider calling either the electric and.or the water company. If *your* pipes are energized it could be very likely that your neighbor's are, too. It could present a hazard beyond your house and they have the proper test equipment to trace the fault.
If you want to do something before help arrives, I might *look* (but not touch) for any clamps with wires that are attached to your water supply lines. Incoming phone terminals, CATV lines, the circuit box area and the furnace areas are places you might find a ground wire connection (no longer code).
--
Bobby G.



Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Sunday, October 27, 2013 9:04:38 PM UTC-4, Robert Green wrote:

Not very likely IMO. Just because his house has screwed up wiring, doesn't mean the neighbor's house does.
It could present a

Now you're off in true lala land. Since when is it no longer code to have those things grounded? In fact they all are supposed to be grounded. Good grief. And to add to the foolishness, what purpose is it going to serve for Fred to go looking for anything when he obviously doesn't have the skills to diagnose this serious problem?
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 10/28/2013 07:14 AM, snipped-for-privacy@optonline.net wrote: <snip> >>

He did not say /ungrounded/ he said grounded to water line
--

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MS85KjUsEm0&feature=youtu.be


Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Monday, October 28, 2013 9:18:34 AM UTC-4, philo  wrote:

ot

y

the

onger

And again, who says that your circuit box (panel)can't be grounded to the water pipe? In fact, it's a code requirement that if a metal water pipe enters the house that the panel be grounded in part to that metal pipe.
And in older homes, not unusual to see the cable or phone system wires being grounded to a cold water pipe near where they enter the building. It's not a safety issue or something that needs to be corrected.
And it's all pointless anyway, because the OP clearly doesn't have the skills to figure out what is or isn't the problem anyway.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Related Threads

    HomeOwnersHub.com is a website for homeowners and building and maintenance pros. It is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.