Set fence post in concrete, dirt, or gravel?

I know I'm beating a dead dog here, but I find myself unclear about the pros/cons of setting fence posts in dirt, gravel, or concrete. More specifically, I'm undecided about which way to go. I need some input from those who have done this. I'm mostly interested in what is strong and what will last the longest. I don't want to have to dig them all out 10 years from now and be stuck with these big concrete chunks.

Dirt: easiest to do, may not be the strongest. It rains a lot here, 9 months out of the year, so I'm concerned about the constant contact with wet soil.

Gravel. Some recently suggested. Cheaper and easier then concrete, gravel drains water from post. Stronger then just dirt, post may last longer. Gravel drains water from post.

Concrete. More work. Strongest. Post in contact with concrete may still rot out in 10 years. Difficult to replace.

Reply to
Ook
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Just had to replace a lamp post that broke from wind shear. I think it was original to the house, 1966. Had to hire someone to replace it for a cost of about $500 because it had to be dug out of the huge concrete chunk it was sitting in, and said chunk had to be broken into removal bits. A real pain. On the other hand, apparently it had lasted forty years. I had the new one set in concrete (with a piece of PVC pipe to protect the electric line so that we didn't have to worry about cutting the power line if we had to break into the concrete again, ever).

Reply to
Inquiringmind

Concrete is obviousl a major PITA to replace, but how long do they last today? In 1966 they used better preservative, and posts would last 50 years. What can I do to my posts today to get at least a couple of decades out of it?

Reply to
Ook

I don't know how long modern wood posts would last. But it's gotta be easier and cheaper to put screws/nails into wood than, say, a cast iron pipe. :) And it's easier than putting a stainless steel achor bolt into the top of a cast iron pipe filled with concrete onto which you could hang your fence wood.

But if you go that way, let us know how it works out. It might look cool. ;)

Reply to
yellowbirddog

I was at the Oregon State Fair yesterday, and one vendor had a system where you pour your concrete plug into the ground and have a square concrete post coming up a few inches out of the ground. Fence post gets bolted to that. Fence post never touches the ground. If fence post rots away, you unbolt it and bolt a new one in it's place. I'd be interested in doing this if I could find instructions and parts.

Reply to
Ook

concrete of not the wood is going to get wet

get a bucket of drivesealer, mix some kerosene with it dip the bottom of the post in it, stack them let them dry... repeat a few times...

set them in dirt, dirt will settle rilltight

but you haven't said what the application is, or what is going to be hanging on the poastseseseseseseseseses

it matters not really, you stick two feet in the ground they won't fall.. you treat the bottoms LIKE I TOLD YOU they will outlive you

WHATEVER YOU DO RENT AN AUGER

ok, since you're forgoing concrete rent the auger

personally I think you should keep talking about it for a few more days

Reply to
sosessyithurts

Just remember that the bottom of your fence post needs to have a lot of bending strength to resist a wind storm. So if the connection at the base will break at near the same loading level that the post will break at, you might have something worthwhile.

Do you have a link to the hardware in question?

Reply to
yellowbirddog

Metal posts in concrete will last indefinitely (or 75 years, whichever comes first). Mine have lasted 42 years and they make even better metal posts today than they did in the '60s.

  1. Dig hole (it can be a lot smaller than if you were using 4x4).
  2. Put a rock in bottom.
  3. Set post in hole - make it straight.
  4. Fill hole with water.
  5. Slowly dump in a bag of concrete.
  6. Repeat steps 1-5 for each post.
Reply to
HeyBub

Wooden fence around my 2/3 acre property. Wood posts set 8 feet apart. Fence will be 6 feet high. I'm thinking of a small support in the middle to prevent sag, as most wooden fences I see sag in the middle of each run.

What is drivesealer? Driveway sealer? Why kerosene, and how much? Will this work on pressure treated ground contact rated posts?

High on my todo list. I'm going out today to stake the posts so I can get an accurate count of how many posts.

I might - the more I discuss it, the more advice I get, the more I learn, and eventually I'll know enough (or think I know enough) that I'll be ready to actually get off of my butt and do something

Reply to
Ook

Personally, I have learned tons from this newsgroup. Usenet may be fading away, but there are still many vaulable newsgroups out there, like this one. My thanks to everyone that has pitched in with comments. Keep them coming!

Reply to
Ook

As a follow-up, and not that I'm recommending anything, but I wonder how that cheap sch 40 black plastic ABS pipe filled with concrete would be as a fence post. I wonder if it'd be strong enough on it's own, of if it'd need to have a little re-mesh inside before you fill it with concrete.

Even if you don't paint it (and it's readily paintable), the carbon black that they add to it is supposed to keep UV rays at bay.

Reply to
yellowbirddog

not if you ask me

google got on the usenet wagon, now google archives these q & a sessions; thus: Google Groups

formatting link
only difference google carries at the big 8 in the heiarchy, they also allow a user to create their own group, where'as with usenet it's not so easy to get a group started

I agree, it really is an "on time" source of help

how long has usenet been around anyway? since the days of 300 baud modems?

Reply to
sosessyithurts

There are more newsgroups then there have ever been, but a lot of popular groups I used to frequent have died. I wonder if there are any usage stats out there? I'd like to see some historical numbers that are probalby more accurate then my opinion.

I didn't discover usenet until I upgraded to a 2400 modem. I think I still have a couple 300 baud modems lying around. I used to use a 2400 modem built for a commodore 64. I built an RS232 interface from Radio Shack parts and hooked it up to my PC/XT. Worked great :P

Reply to
Ook

PS. Tell me more about "drivesealer" that you recommend using on the posts.

Reply to
Ook

that's what we used to treat a horse fence, it came reccommended by a fella who raises cyldesdales

you thin it with kerosene in order to make it soak in better, about 1/2 and 1/2

it's no different than railway ties, you know, the black railroad ties you can find laying around

driveseal oppossed to watersealer, I can't see water sealer lasting more than a few years before it loses its properties

Reply to
sosessyithurts

I found it. Driveway sealer. Driveway and paving sealer. Know of any suppliers in the US for this stuff? A brief romp through the Internet showed it readily available in the UK, NZ, Australia, etc. Or can any good driveway sealer work?

Reply to
Ook

I have used the steel anchors that are designed to be pounded into the ground, but I set them into concrete. You can replace the posts if the bottom rots, and if you keep the steel painted. When installing, take extra care to keep them level because a slight angle can create a crooked post.

Reply to
EXT

oh sure, any home-depot, lowes, ace hardware...

do you have a local DIY home shop? they mighit have it too.. of course if it's cold out.. it will go on a tad thicker and soak in a tad slower

maybe add your city and state to your search terms

Reply to
sosessyithurts

Different types of soil and climate may produce different results. That said, my experience in the Baltimore Md area, is that a CCA PT

4X4 will last AT LEADT 20 years directly in the ground, and in fact at this age they appear to have plenty of life left. (I recently pulled some up that were about 20 years old; I needed to set new, deeper posts because I was replacing a 4 ft fence with a 6 foot fence.)

In fact, the posts will outlast 2 or 3 sets of cedar pickets. The soil that these posts were set in is soft for the first 8 inches or so, then becomes pretty hard, hitting clay at about 2 feet down. I put a few inches of gravel in the bottom of each hole. YMMV. I've seen lots of recommendations to avoid setting posts in concrete, claiming they would rot faster than when set directly in soil. Whethere that's true or not, I don't know, but with the life of a typical PT post set directly in the ground, it certainly is not necessary.

Reply to
lwasserm

It depends on the density of the CCA treating. Some BORG junk is only

0.25 CCA. That is just a green wash. You can get it up to 2.50 CCA that they use in salt water here in Florida. That would last forever in northern dirt and a half a century here. Typical "direct burial" rated posts are 0.80 here but I have some that were 0.40 and listed that way. I got about 10 years out of them.
Reply to
gfretwell

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