San Bruno go boom!

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you do realize that you are getting the EXACT same electricity as everyone else..
the only thing you can choose is where your money goes to pay for it.
Mark
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With properly maintained facilities, natural gas is safe. Considering the number of households and commercial establishments of all kinds that use NG, the number of accidents and fatalities is small. Gasoline etc probably have at least as many (BP well blowing up).
Now as far as proper maintenance, I don't understand the use of a 54" inch main gas line only 3 feet under a residential area. In an earthquake prone region. I bet that it will turn out that the residents have warned many times (probably crying wolf too many times, as far as PG&E was concerned), and that the line was NOT inspected often enough and recently enough. Wouldn't want to have shares in that company ...
But, mismanagement by 1 company shouldn't condemn the whole concept.
Of course, it is OT, and YMMV!!
--
Best regards
Han
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On Sat, 11 Sep 2010 20:16:52 +0000, Han wrote:

Was the 54" main there when the allotment was created or installed after?
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The community dates from the 60s. I don't know who was first. I don't think it matters at this moment.
--
Best regards
Han
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On Sat, 11 Sep 2010 21:40:08 +0000, Han wrote:

Sure it matters. Maybe not to the explosion victims so much but rather that you seemed to place PG&E at fault for placing the 54" 3 feet under the community. Can't quote you exactly since you snipped that part out.
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On 9/11/2010 6:07 PM, A. Baum wrote:

Pretty sure they don't put subdivisons, or at least the house footprints, DIRECTLY on top of major gas transmission lines like that. I've seen them cut across the corners of subdivisions, but the easement always said there had to be a clear zone with no permanent structures directly above, and instant access when needed, for sniffer trucks and the big yellow things. The pipeline companies try real hard to lay them out based on 30+ years of undisturbed usage. Almost always they go through farm fields.
I've never seen a neighborhood distribution line bigger than 6-8 inches or so. About 15? years ago, this town had a small oopsie, where they connected a higher-pressure trunk line to the feeder for a neighborhood, with stepping down the pressure. About a dozen houses lit off, when the furnaces and water heaters suddenly had 10x the gas volume coming in. Police and FD had to break out their doomsday book, and call in all 3 shifts, and outside assistance. I think some court cases are still floating around from that one. Thankfully, nobody got killed. That is the only mass residential gas fubar I recall around this town- there were a couple of commercial buildings that tried to launch themselves, but they turned out to be insurance scams.
--
aem sends...


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aemeijers wrote:

There was a nat. gas transmission line that blew in the northeast that was directly *under* an apartment building and completely leveled it.

The line appears to be a high pressure transmission line (~600 PSI I believe), not a distribution line to service homes.
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That was a natural gas major transmission line too close to the building (s), not under it/them. There was 1 fatality, but the fault lay with people digging there, and with inadequate inspection and maintenance. For details see (on 1 line, with comma): <"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edison,_New_Jersey_natural_gas_explosion">.
The lesson is that you should find out what is in the area where you want to live before moving there.
--
Best regards
Han
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The only thing I heard/read was a 54" main gas line that was 3' underground in a residential community.
--
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Han
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On 9/11/2010 4:25 PM Han spake thus:

Pretty sure that it is a 24" line. That's what I've been hearing from the teevee nooz the last couple days here.
--
The fashion in killing has an insouciant, flirty style this spring,
with the flaunting of well-defined muscle, wrapped in flags.
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David Nebenzahl wrote:

The pictures seem to show something in the 24" range. It also appears to be a high pressure transmission line, not a distribution line.
I own some property that has one of those transmission lines crossing it way back on the property. I heard that some years back it had a blowout which never ignited, but did blow a 10' crater in the frozen ground (was winter). They apparently traced the failure to a scrape by a backhoe tooth when burying the pipeline years earlier.
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Han wrote the following:

News Reports say portions of the pipeline weres installed in the 1940s and 1950s before the houses were there.
--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
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Han wrote:

Some 6.6 residential nat. gas fires and/or explosions (they tend to go together) per *DAY* (NFPA statistics) may be small relative to the total number of residential nat. gas installations, but it is unacceptably high given the many safer alternatives, and at the very least the availability of inexpensive gas detectors (every RV has one).

A nat. gas transmission line that blew in the northeast (NJ I believe) was *under* and apartment building. What shit-for-brains allowed that, and how much were they bribed?
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See my other answer - it was NEXT to an apartment building and inadequate inspection and maintenance was responsible.
Also, I said above that one should examine what might be in the area that you contemplate moving to.
--
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Han
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Perhaps you need to re-think who it is that has the questionable brains. The gas pipeline you're talking about was NOT under an apartment building. It didn't even pass through the land the apartment building was on. It was located hundreds of feet away from the apartment building in Edison, NJ. While you make it sound like a mega disaster, this incident resulted in a total of 1 deaths. How many deaths each year are involved in the alternate fuels that we commonly use and that would be substituted for NG? For example, if you look at all the deaths associated with an alternate fuel like heating oil, including everything from faulty oil burner systems to traffic fatalities, you aren't going to wind up with a meaningfully different number of fatalities than the 43 per year from NG.
Also, if NG is so unsafe, why is it that it's widely used around the world, including many far more regulated places run by progressive socialist type govts that make themselves out to be very enlightened? Is there one place in the world that has taken your suggestion to get rid of it?
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I think that is a gross exageration. About 50,000 people die each year from motor vehicle accidents. That's 2 orders of magnitude more than those that die from natural gas.

That would be some network of sensors. They would have to be placed every 20 feet along the side of roads where gas lines run to start. And subject to rain, salt, slush.... How much do you think that would cost to install and maintain? And you'd get 1000X false alarms for every one valid one.
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