Rotary Hammer questions


When purchasing a rotary hammer, they come with either SDS, SDS-Plus or SDS-max. I understand SDS-max is a different slot system, but there seems to be no visible difference between SDS and SDS-plus. Is there?
Also, what does the size mean in a rotary hammer? For example a <1" SDS-plus BULLDOG Xtreme Rotary Hammer> what does the 1" mean? It is totally unrelated to the actual bit sizes, I mean you do not buy a bit that is rated for a 1" hammer or a 7/8" hammer, so what is the significance of the size of a hammer?
Thanks,
MC
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When purchasing a rotary hammer, they come with either SDS, SDS-Plus or SDS-max. I understand SDS-max is a different slot system, but there seems to be no visible difference between SDS and SDS-plus. Is there?
Also, what does the size mean in a rotary hammer? For example a <1" SDS-plus BULLDOG Xtreme Rotary Hammer> what does the 1" mean? It is totally unrelated to the actual bit sizes, I mean you do not buy a bit that is rated for a 1" hammer or a 7/8" hammer, so what is the significance of the size of a hammer?
Thanks,
MC
I can't help you much but will bump the thread.
Unless you are going to use this once a week, the el-cheapo sds from Harbor Freight for $59 is about all you will ever need.
Colbyt
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In article
snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com says...

It's an informal rating, The manufacturer claims it will drill 1" holes in 'average' concrete in a 'reasonable' time, a 'significant' number of times. It may drill larger holes in weaker materials, smaller holes in very high strength concrete, etc.
--
Dennis


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When purchasing a rotary hammer, they come with either SDS, SDS-Plus or SDS-max. I understand SDS-max is a different slot system, but there seems to be no visible difference between SDS and SDS-plus. Is there?
Also, what does the size mean in a rotary hammer? For example a <1" SDS-plus BULLDOG Xtreme Rotary Hammer> what does the 1" mean? It is totally unrelated to the actual bit sizes, I mean you do not buy a bit that is rated for a 1" hammer or a 7/8" hammer, so what is the significance of the size of a hammer?
====================================================
SDS max is a much bigger diameter, for bigger hammers and rotary hammers. I think SDS-Plus is alightly bigger than plain SDS.
Hole size: I believe it's the size of the hole the motor is equipped to drill in concrete, long term. Not 100% sure, but that's what I surmise.
Having said that, I have the Bulldog, and it is a very capable tool -- so-called "D-handle".. But, unless you are doing a lot of hole drilling, you might be better off with the pistol grip equivalent, which is much more ergonometric for most drilling, and packs a helluva wallop, as far as hard concrete goes.
Colbert may be right about HF stuff, but you have to be careful about the type of hammer. "Hammer drills" typically have 15-20,000 bps (bumps per second), and even quality ones (milwaukee, porter cable) will handle only so much hard concrete/stone. "Rotary Hammers" have many fewer bps, typically about 5,000, but each "bump" carries significantly more stone-breaking energy in each bump. What could take a hammer drill 5-10 minutes of supreme effort (and probably numerous wasted carbide bits) will take 5-30 seconds with a bulldog or equivalent. Night and day.
HF stuff is OK, if the applications are not critical or demanding. I have bought a lot of HF stuff, and am quite happy with their winches and a couple of other things. Their close-quarter drill is OK, comes in handy. But you will most likely appreciate the Bulldog if you have real work to do.
Oh, since I have both handy:
The D-handle bulldog (11224 VSR) is 0-1100 rpm, 0-6150 bpm, 6.9 A. The pistol grip Bulldog is subnamed RotoHammer (11250 VSR), and is 0-1350 rpm, 0-6,000 bpm, 6.0 A.
Both come with a rotatable siide handle. The D-handle comes in a metal case. The pistol grip was hard to find, and I wound up getting a display model with no cord for $35 from HD. Don't know about a case for the pistol grip.
And speaking of HD, a good hardware store will beat HD prices by 10%, and at worst will match HD. It is said that stuff sold by HD is made *for* HD, and made more cheaply, and there is no way for the consumer to really know what's what. I won't bet the farm on this, but I've heard this from a number of sources.
Either Bosch or Hilti, on either their lit or placards, list the energy per bump in joules for each tool! For quite an accurate comparison. You'd proly be hardpressed to find these numbers for the higher bpm hammer drills, but I'll bet the numerical difference would be, uh, striking.
--
EA

Thanks,

MC



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Oh, that should be bpm, bumps per minute, not seconds.
--
EA


> --
> EA
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On 11/6/2009 4:12 PM Existential Angst spake thus:

Well, it doesn't take much to figure that out: I don't see a lot of (or any for that matter) "Chicago" tools sold anywhere else, or even tools that look like them. You know, those ugly orange portable power tools.
I've got a few Chicago tools (i.e., Harbor Freight) and am happy with them, but I don't use them day in and day out.
--
Who needs a junta or a dictatorship when you have a Congress
blowing Wall Street, using the media as a condom?
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Exactly how would a consumer "figure out" that Bosch et al make, say, a Bulldog 11224 VSR *just for HD*, but which appears identical to "other" Bosch 11224's?
HD is little more than a pervasive destructive mold on the fabric of society. But a diabolical penicillin-resistant mold.
--
EA


I don\'t see a lot of (or
> any for that matter) "Chicago" tools sold anywhere else, or even tools
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On 11/7/2009 12:16 AM Existential Angst spake thus:

>

My bad; I mistook your "HD" for "HF".

Yep. (But I still shop there. Help me ...)
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Thanks for the info. I already have a pistol grip Bosch Bulldog rotary hammer, it was a hand-me-down and I have always used the half dozen or so masonry bits that was with it but recently I needed a chipping bit. I use it once in a while. I have a hammer drill as well from Makita and used it only for small masonry holes like drilling holes for Tapcons.
As for Harbor Freight I have purchased a few tools from there but each time end up tossing them out and replacing them.
I guess the 1" rating got me confused. It just seemed a but arbitrary to rate a rotary hammer this way.
MC
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replying to MiamiCuse, Pablo wrote: Harbor freight sells junk electric tools.
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MC-
I find the chuck style designations confusing. I have a small rotary hammer (Milwaukee Falcon) and a larger (midsized) Hilti TE-54
Originally the TE-54 used TE-Y type bits (& years ago were referred to as Hilti SDS) but this are now also referred to as SDS Max
The Falcon (when I got it was referred to as SDS Plus or SDS+)
all of which I still find confusing........whenever I go to buy a bit for a particular tool, I either bring matching bit to compare or, if buying online, I double / triple check to make sure the chuck style is correct.
I believe you are correct, in that now, SDS & SDS Plus (SDS+) are the same and used on smaller capacity hammers. Larger hammers use SDS Max (the old / current Hilti TE-Y chuck system)
I routinely use my Falcon (nominal 3/4" hammer drill) to drill 5/32" thru 5/8" holes in concrete but I've also used it to drill 7/8" & 1" holes as well. The larger / longer bits will tax the capacity of the tool.
If I need to drill LARGE holes, deep holes or lots of smaller (like 1/2 to 3/4"), I'd use the TE-54. But for a small number of holes or smaller diameter I like the easy handling of the Falcon.
With the TE-54 I've drilled holes as large as 1 5/8" x 12" in concrete but these were clearly beyond the normal capacity of the TE-54 and I should have used a Hilti water cooled diamond coring system, but I only need to drill 5 holes.
You CAN use larger bits in a small capacity tool if you dont over do it.
I've used Milwaukee, Hilti & Bosch rotary hammers and Hilti's have been the best; long trouble free service and fastest drillling. Bosch have been the worst. :(
cheers Bob
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