roof leak

[tom]

Any idea how old this roof may be? I saw nothing about that in his decription. Another idea may be an improperly installed bathroom vent exhaust. Tom

[coloradotrout]

House built in 2000, so pretty new..

I just see a small spot on the master bath ceiling that sure looks like some moisture is getting through the roof.

It rains about 40"/year here, though we had about 10" more this year.

I will definitely putt some roofing cement over that one nail. The nail actuall is driven through the top shingle.. or the shingle has lifted up over the nail. Either way, it cannot be good.

[aemeijers]

If it is right downhill from the window, the window may be the problem. Some flashing failure around that (usually at the top), and water could be running down the wall under the siding beside it, and then down the roof deck under the shingles. I'd start with a dab of tar on the nail, just to see if that solves it, but spot leaks like this can be a real needle in a haystack search.

-- aem sends...

[coloradotrout]

Yeah, I know -- and with a newer home I don't want to start tearing into it. But I suppose I could be creating a serious mold issue in the attic, but pulling off a chunk of drywall from the master bath will be a huge mess with blown-in insulation.

Here's to hoping it's the nail hole!!

[RicodJour]

You are proceeding on a fool's errand dabbing some roofing cement on the nail head and thinking that will solve your problem. It might temporarily stop the leak, if indeed that is the sole cause of the leak, but if the nail did work it's way up through the shingle, it will do it again through the roofing cement.

If it makes you feel any better there are a whole boatload of really bad roofers that would treat your problem the same way you are heading.

You had some requests for additional information, and instead provided another real estate listing picture. That is odd since it would be very easy for you to take pictures now that you know how to post them. Pictures with actual information of the problem area.

R

[norminn]

I would not dab gunk on a protruding nail head. At minimum, it seems the nail head should be cut off flush; then cement the shingle (or replace it) and fill the nail hole. If the nail head protrudes, it could be because of decking that is warped or could allow the deck to warp. The photos are lovely but tell nothing about the conditions on the roof - any bulges, curled shingles, cracked shingles?

As much as possible of the attic space should be inspected after a good, steady rain to look for other signs of leaks. Signs of leaks can occur a long distance from the actual leak because the water can run down rafters, pipes and wiring. You can also get splashback under roofing when gutters are full or not properly aligned.

[clare]

If the roofing tar on the nail stops the leak he knows what needs to be fixed next year. If it doesn't, he knows that is NOT the problem.

Would be good if he had a way to know FOR SURE if the leak is stopped

- i.e. - be able to get into the attic to confirm.

[clare]

Thankfully the rain will only run DOWN, not UP, so it makes it a bit easier to track down.

[RicodJour]

And if it stops it for a while like a bandaid will stop bleeding for a while...? Now it's the dead of winter and you expect Joe Homeowner to get up on an icy roof? What's the point of dicking around with a bandaid instead of determining what is causing the leak, what exactly is going on with nail, and fixing them?

Yeah, it would be good. Experienced eyeballs can tell from the outside more than inexperienced eyeballs can tell from the inside. And you're telling him to not bother just slap on the bandaid and see if the bleeding stops.

That's like that doctor in A Civil Action that told the parents to give the kid with leukemia a couple of aspirin, and the kid died the next day on the way to the hospital.

R

[norminn]

If the water runs down a rafter or wiring, it can also go across...BTDT.

[clare]

Across yes, up no.

[clare]

The "bandaid" will get him through to spring. Not a good time to do reroofing right now in LARGE parts of North America. I wouldn't trust a "fall/winter" roof as much as a "summer" roof - wnter roofs have problems with tabs not sticking down, among other things.

And that "bandaid" may well last longer than the rest of the roof. Now, I'd likely PULL the nail before tatting it, or better yet tat it, knock it down, and tar over it to prevent it becoming a problem again, without losing the holding power of the nail, however little it was.. I've "patched" a lot of roofs over the years with a dab of bulldog wetstick or other fibrated plastic roofing cement - and it's still holding years later when the roof finally requires replacement.

[norminn]

Do you feel compelled to state the obvious?

[RicodJour]

Just keep digging. Yeah, a dab of roofing cement will outlast a new roof. Right. I do appreciate that you put patched in quotes, because we both know it's not a legitimate repair except in remote circumstances. General roofing rule of thumb is if you see roof cement up on a roof, or worse yet, on flashing, whoever put the crap up there was a hack.

A nail that has already lost it's grip won't magically reacquire it when you swat it with a hammer. Nobody is talking about reroofing, and patching a roof is not a problem at this time of the year - it's done all of the time. But when snow and ice build up on the roof, and that little dab of roof cement turns out to not _quite_ have done the trick, patching the roof becomes a major PITA. Tabs not sticking is not a problem - that's one place that a dab or roofing cement will come in handy and won't be a bandaid.

You're coming up with a whole procedure of how you'd fix it, and you don't even know what you need to fix. You've stated your guesstimate case, "put a dab of roofing cement on it, and hope for the best", and told the guy what he was _hoping_ to hear - that it's no big deal and a five minute repair. Do you think that's the only nail that has a problem? Based on what - your gut feeling?

Let's go back to what the OP asked in the beginning, before you side- tracked him with your, "ah, it's nothing, dab a little roof snot on the nail."

He wrote: " What else do I need to look for? How should the roof shingles as they meet the dormer walls be installed? It just seems like that is a leak waiting to happen with a wall running down to a roof where it cannot be properly capped. Is there some sort of flashing there?"

Those are legitimate questions. Your answers addressed none of these. To address those questions we need more information, which the OP was trying to provide until you played on his hopes of it being a trivial repair. Maybe it is, and maybe it's not, but we need information to figure out what's going on, not a bandaid "patch" based on your guesses.

R

[clare]

You are right - more info required - but the flashing is LIKELY not the problem as it didn't leak the first couple of years - and the popped nail WOULD cause a leak. When you hear hoofbeats, think horses, not wildebeast unless you are on the sarengetti.

De's been told just about everything to check for by the "sky is falling crew".

Goober the popped nail head and keep checking for the rest. Absolutely, without question, a popped nail coming through a shingle WILL leak - so look after that first. (horses)

THEN start looking for Zebras and Wildebeast.

[RicodJour]

te:

I want to see a picture because I have a feeling that the "roofer" put a cap piece of shingle on top of the flashing and nailed through it.

OP - cough up some more pictures.

R

[Ctroofer]

I am a professsional roofer located in CT. The leak is probably at the pitch change between the upper steeply pitched roof and the lower "moderately" pitched roof. The step flashing in this area is two small to handle the backwash of the pitch change. We usually cover the entire lower pitched are with self adhesive ice & water barrier and install an oversized flashing detail at the pitch change the covers the last two sourse of the low pitched roof. Good luck!

[RicodJour]

I don't know about that. It's possible, but the OP's sorry picture has the arrow pointing to a spot that's a distance away from the step flashing on the pitched part of the roof running along that wall, and under the window. There's no up-slope area, just the wall and window. We need better pictures! Coloradotrout, provide them forthwith!

R

[coloradotrout]

Ok.. got some pics..

Most of them are taken below the window which is nearly above the area that is leaking into the bathroom below. Some, however, are taken in other areas of the roof to give you a general idea of the roof and roofing work that was done. I see flashing pretty much everywhere. But I also see a lot of exposed nail heads on the ridges and along the top where the shingles meet the dormers.

My apologies -- I sorely lack the proper vocabulary on this topic.

On the first row of images.. image 1 is the upper left-hand corner of that window -- above the trip seems pretty well caulked, but what I show here is the gap between face of the window and the trim image 2 , 3, and 4 are just other areas of the roof to give an idea of the condition -- they are in fact along the front of the house whereas the trouble spot seems to be along the side of the house

On the 2nd row.. image 1 is that sunken nail head that is nearly directly above the leak on the 1st level bathroom image 2 , 3, and 4 are in the area where the cursor is for the last image showing a couple shots of the surrounding area

Hope this helps.

I really cannot find something that stands out. All those exposed nail heads really bug me. If that nail extends down into the roof -- which of course it must -- that has to be a leak potential.

[Oren]

You don't show a pic of above the window trim. Often that caulking is overlooked. Water travels behind and down.

How about if you move the nail an inch or so?

Sometimes they look good in another position.