Removal of roof truss cross-members, to make for easier attic storage access...[??]

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Goedjn wrote:

Which doesn't solve OP's problem of limited access which is the whole point of the thread...
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Why don't you just go in there with a sawzall and cut everything out of your way. That way, when the roof falls in, you can have it rebuilt with rafters and then you will have lots of room. And that will only cost about $20,000.00.
--
JerryD(upstateNY)

> If you\'re a half decent carpenter and you throw enough 2x4\'s at it,
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composed
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NIX on the sistering.
Truss calculations are figured from the bottom of the truss. Just how much weight are you planning on adding? any significant weight on the top of the truss can spell disaster.
I use my attic to store empty boxes that are broken down. total weight, maybe 50 pounds spread out over a 4x8 sheet of plywood.
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In a previous post Ken Moiarty says...

Ken:
STOP!!!!
What you are suggesting is a recipe for disaster.
1) It is quite likely that the trusses were NOT designed for attic storage.
2) Cutting any truss members will void any warranty that the truss manufacturer may have given or may be implied in your state law. In other words if the roof collapses, you will have no legal recourse.
3) Rent a storage locker. It will be cheaper and much much safer.
--
Bob Morrison, PE, SE
R L Morrison Engineering Co
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composed
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You are joking aren't you???????????
Most residential trusses are designed to hold up the roof and the drywall.
Attic junk not included. Floor load not included.
Colbyt
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Crazy idea. Sure, there may be some method, but do you really trust a bunch of us crazies on a newsgroup to tell you how to re-do your roof support? Only way to know is to have a qualified engineer look at the situation. Not knowing the spans, load, new floor load, etc, you can be in real serious trouble with this.
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Colbyt wrote:

I guess that explains how I can load my roof with 120 bundles of shingles and 5 guys (and that's in addition to the weight of the existing shingles).
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In a previous post Some Guy says...

Cut a few truss members and try it. That's what the OP was proposing.
Most roofers I've seen at least make an attempt to spread the load out some. If you pile all 120 bundles in one place then a roof failure would not be unexpected.
As for the 5 guys, I assume they are moving around and not sitting in a bunch having a smoke. That makes them "short-term" load and wood is pretty forgiving for that type of loading.
--
Bob Morrison, PE, SE
R L Morrison Engineering Co
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Some Guy wrote:

The truss is designed to be toploaded. If you put that same load on the bottom chord of those same trusses they would fail.
Trusses are the most economical use of wood possible. Why do you feel that they would build in all sorts of reserve strength (and give it away)?
R
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I didn't mention the design load for one nail over because I did not want some fool trying to figure out how much attic junk that equaled.
It all comes to down to weight distribution and time.
Modify a truss or two the house most likely won't cave in. Over time you may have some serious problems.
Your house, do as you wish. I won't help you do it by giving you risky advice.
Colbyt
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stretching my memory of wood structures class...... the allowable load for temp load was 133% of normal. Impact was 200%
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Colbyt ( snipped-for-privacy@stopspam.lexkyweb.com) said...

The trusses have some extra load capabilities. Afterall, they must support workers up there moving around.
That said, many peoples' attic crap can easily exceed that capability quite quickly!
--
Calvin Henry-Cotnam
"Never ascribe to malice what can equally be explained by incompetence."
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Huh? Virtually any truss manufacturer will design and supply attic trusses for "bonus space". It's not exactly a complicated or new problem. The problem is that if the truss *WASN'T* designed for that, then it's almost certainly because the system can't be easily modified to do it, else they WOULD have, when it went in.
And in someone else's post:

Work that through again... If the truss has, say 500# of excess temporary support ability, because you need that for workers, and you use that extra 500# for storage, what happens when the workers show up?
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Even if the house plans provided an attic access, this does not mean the trusses were designed to take an additional load above the ceiling. Its implied by the attic access provided by the builder, but that doesn't mean its true.
The chords tie the joist to the rafters in a typically angular fashion. These are mutually supportive of both the joist and the rafter.
Trusses are designed to provide a minimum ceiling load as is. Especially the exclusive 2X4 type. I wouldn't trust these without the chords in place. A long run over a bedroom, living area etc is inviting disaster for storage purposes in the attic. You cut the chords, and its an even worse situation.
Conventionally framed roofs with ceiling joists of adequate width meant for storage is probably the only type one can safely store your stuff in the attic. A few truss designers will design these if the ceiling load specs are provided by the builder, but its not seen very often.

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you people are complete idiots for even trying to tell this person ways on how to attempt this on his own. ive done framing for 15 years. just framing. NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER cut or modify a truss in ANY way without the approval of a engineer or the truss co. ive fallen thro trusses because the gangnails have given out (cheap pine) and i'm only 190 pounds. yea, lets pile a bunch of junk up there

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I just saw this exact same thing on 'House Detective' on TLC. Someone removed the center posts on a trusts an used 2x4 lag bolted in to the remaining top and cross members.(yeah, I'm hooked those shows, but they occasionally have really good info)
The result. The roof was fine but the floor was sagging. There was about a 4" sag from the floor was originally(in the center)
Eitherway, knowing that a house is usually someones largest asset, do you really want to compromise its value by cutting corners. Either find an engineer or find a different space to store clutter.
c_kubie
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Thanks for all the helpful replies to my query. I absolutely had no idea that using the attic to store things could pose a problem! But based on what you people have told me here -plus the the regrettable realization from my own observations that my house was built as cheaply and shoddily as its builders could legally get away with- I now realize my attic CANNOT be used for storage in any case.
Rant: For a home that sold for hundreds of thousands of dollars, you'd think the builder could've been a little more liberal budgetwise and built the house to higher spec.
Ken
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scribbled this interesting note:

Really? Seems you fail to understand that as with any business these days, accounting is what actually runs it, not the quality control department!:~(
-- John Willis (Remove the Primes before e-mailing me)
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Accounting is just a tool. As with any tool, the tool itself doesn't determine what your mix of priorities are to be. "People", with their objectives, interests, values, aspirations and desires etc. ultimately determine that. If the people don't enter "quality control" into their accounting equations, it is 'people' who have chosen to not do so, not the 'science of accounting'.
You seem to imply that "quality" is some kind of silly, superfluous, entity, which is non-essential to productive business activity. Though I expect no shortage of, say... overpaid government bureacrats, slick talking used-car salesmen, or back street drug dealers, etc... who'd likely be eager to agree with you, I for one beg to differ!:~)
Ken
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scribbled this interesting note:

Sorry if what I said seemed to imply what you inferred. It was not my intention. The point being exactly as you made it. The lack of quality is caused by a short term focus on one portion of the equation, that being the bottom line at the end of the day, instead of the end of the decade. It is an unfortunate state of affairs that the "Wal-Mart" syndrome is everywhere...
-- John Willis (Remove the Primes before e-mailing me)
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