Range clock - Disconnect it!

Page 6 of 12  
snipped-for-privacy@vt.edu wrote:

That's the funniest thing I've heard today, and probably this week!
<snip>

I don't even have a receiver hooked up. I ran and built sound for a number of years and I'm pretty much over it!
Still, I've been think about getting one of my Dad's old radios up and running. The tubes look like light bulbs and have 2 digit numbers. I think it would be wise to run that rarely.
I assume new stuff

Exactly. Though at lot of the low hanging fruit has been picked in

I still see loads of 8.5 EER non Energy Star AC's on the market. I realize payback can be several years, but I wonder if it isn't in everyone's best interest to get those off the market.
I don't know how this would be implemented but there's a lot of older homes that are poorly insulated. Many with no wall insulation and little attic and underfloor. Those home probably use double or so the energy for poorer results. Perhaps a Habitat for Home Efficiency to rehab these old homes with blown in cellulose. A $400 investment will probably pay for itself in a year or so. I think much of the energy waste is at the top and bottom of the economic spectrum. The bottom is hard to reach and the top end just doesn't care (its that old, "I got mine, screw you"). I have a very wealthy (CEO) friend and his home uses more at idle than mine would if I turned everything on!
Jeff

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On 6/3/2008 8:00 AM snipped-for-privacy@vt.edu spake thus:

Don't blame the engineers here; blame the marketroids who have visions of dollar signs dancing in their eyes on account of all those kewl new features.
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Just as the microwave has a clock based timer that counts down and shuts if off too. Makes is saver for children and seniours to use over other cooking apliances. Why would you want to eliminate that? You could step back 20 years and put in a windup timer but I don't see any real savings there.
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a 1 watt load == 8769 watts/year
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max wrote:

More exactly, there are almost 8766 hours in a year so a 1 Watt load would total 8766 Watt-hours/year or 8.766 kWh. At my cost (Los Angeles) of about 14 cents per kWh this amounts to $1.22.
These things can add up though. A Watt here, a half dozen there and soon you're talking several tens of dollars per year.
Anthony
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sigh...
<http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/00000.html 106 million households
that's $1.22/household/year/watt * 106e6 house $129,000,000 pissed away nationally for nothing.
And, to reiterate, that's for _one_ watt of power draw.
.max
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wrote:

= about $1.50 a year
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duh.
Remember, that figure is for a single, solitary, one watt load. You're correct tha on an individual basis, it's nothing. Of course, in reality, in an average home that value is actually on the order of twenty to one hundred times greater than one watt. Eventually piffling little expenses like this add up for people, some more than others.
On a national basis, in the context of national energy policy, it becomes truly significant.
.max
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A countdown timer doesn't require a full-fledged time-of-day clock with a display that is on all the time. Indeed, most modern microwaves allow you to turn the TOD clock display off by hitting stop/clear when it first powers up and the clock isn't set. That's a good feature.
I did point out that my coffee maker has a clock because I like the safety feature of a timed cutoff. But, a simple countdown timer could accomplish the safety cutoff. The TOD clock part is useless to me, though I can see how some people can use that for timed starts. Just having the option to turn the TOD clock display off would be a good thing, in my opinion.
Bill Ranck Blacksburg, Va.
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snipped-for-privacy@vt.edu wrote

But it doesnt any effect on the current draw with the device idling.

But doing it that way wont necessarily save any power over one that just the display off when the timed cutoff completes.

I just use it as a convenient clock in the kitchen.

Only if it actually saves any power.
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If designed properly it would. A TOD clock chip needs power 24/7, but a countdown timer chip doesn't need power when the device shuts off.
Bill Ranck Blacksburg, Va.
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snipped-for-privacy@vt.edu wrote

Nope.
But that can be done with a coin cell that lasts for years and is with most watches and clocks.

Sure, but the difference is completely trivial in practice, you get the shelf life of the coin cell in both cases.
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Of course nobody builds kitchen appliances that way.

Again, nobody uses coin cells in kitchen appliances, they all leach power from the mains to keep their TOD clocks going. Adding a battery would add manufacturing cost, just changing to a countdown timer would not.
Bill Ranck Blacksburg, Va.
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snipped-for-privacy@vt.edu wrote
But that does show what is trivially feasible current use wise.

Again, since you get the shelf life from the coin cell, that shows just how much mains power is actually wasted in that TOD clock, nothing.

And getting that trivial current from the mains doesnt.

Just leaving the TOD clock with that trivial current drain doesnt either.
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Sure it is. At the end of the billing cycles, do you pay more for the on time or the off time?
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Nope, home electronics aint the same thing as appliances.

You pay more for the on time with APPLIANCES.
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how much water? call it about a gallon. This is an very large amount of water, since when most of us want to boil water in 5 minutes we're talking about coffee/tea water. But hey, it's an easy number.
It takes about 1200 BTU to boil a gallon of water
BTU suck, so the conversion to watts is 1 BTU = 0.3 watt-hours
ergo 1200BTU *.3watt-hrs/btu = 360 watt-hours.
now...let's do the math...
365days x 24 hrs/day 8760 = hours/year
If your LED clock uses 1 watt/hour then it consumes 8760 watt-hours/year. If your stove clock is LED, 1 watt is __very__ conservative and generous to your case.
8760 > 360
THEREFORE: It takes at least 24 times as much energy to run your 1 watt LED clock as to boil a gallon of water.
surprised? Time is a funny thing...
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i got interrupted and forgot what i was doing. dammit.
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snipped-for-privacy@vt.edu wrote:

If e.g. a PC uses 5 watts "off" and 200 watts "on" it's not rocket science to figure out what fraction of time it must be used for the "on" power to equal or exceed the "off" power. I suspect plenty of PC's don't make the cut (or do, but just barely).
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Pity the original claim was made about APPLIANCES where thats almost never true.
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