Railroad torpedos

[Steve B]

All you need to know from Trains Magazine. And yes, Victoria, they were made out of dynamite.

Steve

[Doug Miller]

Even more to know. And no, Steve, they were not. Among other things, railroad torpedos existed almost 30 years before dynamite was invented.

[JIMMIE]

Not the ones I am familiar with. I dont know if there were another type made. I do know for sure one ingredient they had in them, sand.

Jimmie

[Tony]

Interesting reading. I remember cabooses.

[gfretwell]

I question that book if the "fusee" article is any indication of the accuracy. They are what we call "highway flares" today. My brother in law was a brakeman and always had a few in his trunk. He also had torpedoes. In fact they used to sell them in a few states before 1966 when all of the "good" firecrackers were banned (real M-80s, cherry bombs etc) I still say torpedoes were made with potassium chlorate and sulfur

[JIMMIE]

Wikipedia say they used black powder. Having cut more than a few open I'm not sure I agree with that either unless it was a special blend with a lot of sulfur.

Jimmie

[Steve B]

I would say that they were made from all sorts of things. Many manufacturers and many formulas. Including dynamite. But I do know that just as we used to smash a whole roll of paper caps with a hammer and get a big boom, a train wheel will make a big pop when it runs over anything that has explosive potential.

As an afterstatement, they said that fusees were impossible to put out. They are not. You just have to smack them a couple of times to loosen up the flaming part and get it to fall out of the end, and then it breaks the burning part off. Those things will still burn if you put them in water.

So, the article is not TOTALLY true.

Steve

[Steve B]

Wikipedia say they used black powder. Having cut more than a few open I'm not sure I agree with that either unless it was a special blend with a lot of sulfur.

Jimmie

Jimmie, I bet there were a lot of manufacturers and recipes in the century plus that they were used.

Steve

[Steve B]

Well, you said it, that does it. Forget about what the magazine article said. They're just a bunch of experienced train buff people who know less than you.

Steve

[gfretwell]

The problem with the dynamite idea is the brissance of nitroglycerine is so high that it might shatter a railroad wheel. It had to be a low explosive. I am also less than certain that crushing dynamite would actually set it off. Most high explosives require a detonator. (AKA dynamite cap) I fear they just use dynamite as a generic explosive term. "Caps" like you used in your Roy Rogers cap gun were potassium chlorate and sulfur. That is also the explosive element in match heads. (if you ever experimented with those you understand). That is what the Unibomber used.

[gfretwell]

I would venture to say they are railroad experts, not explosive/pyrotechnic experts. I am not an expert by any means but I was in "ordinance" for 6 years in the military. I have a grazing understanding of propellants, low explosives and high explosives. "Dynamite" is a casually used term for anything that goes boom for most people.

[WW]

flaming part and get it to fall out of the end, and then it breaks the

As a teenager I would mix sulfur and Potassium chlorate 50 /50 mix. Put in small glass bottles and cork them. Take to shooting range and hit with 22 cal bullets. Made nice explosion. NOTE this is very dangerous to mix due to pressure is used to detonate. Some people have been injured or killed by trying to mix with a mortar & postal. I carefully mixed it on a sheet of paper by tilting it back and forth until mixed. WW

[trader4]

Seems reasonable that it would not set it off, at least not reliably. One of the big advantages of dynamite was how stable it is and how difficult it is to set it off accidently. Just banging it around won't set it off. Seems like there are a lot of other formulations better suited to the application.

Another apparent inaccuracy from the same article that makes me wonder:

"By carrying its own oxygen supply, like a rocket, a fusee burns very bright and very hot. If you see a railroader holding a fusee in his hand, he has either got good gloves or a fresh fusee that hasn't warmed up yet. "

Yes, they burn very hot, but only right at the end where it is burning and the heat doesn't transfer down the length very well. It would have to be near the end for it to get so hot you couldn't hold it. A bigger problem is that little flaming bits can spew off and land on your hand while holding it, unless you avoid holding it upright. That is likely what the gloves were needed for.

[Steve B]

wrote

At least you are open to the idea that there are many different mixtures that were used, and can read an article and take it FWIW.

I handled underwater explosive shape charges, but we only placed them. The powder monkey set it all up. My true knowledge and understanding obviously does not run that deep.

Steve

[JIMMIE]

I have seen railroad men hang on to these things until they were almost burned up.

Jimmie

[Doug Miller]

Uhh, no, it's not *me* that said it, it's the authors of the article I cited. Apparently you missed that.

Apparently you missed the fact that railroad torpedoes were patented in 1841, and dynamite in 1867.

Apparently you believe that being a train buff automatically makes a person an explosives expert too.

[Steve B]

No, I just like to refer to people with more knowledge and experience than me when I don't know it all.

Steve

[JIMMIE]

I think torpedoes and fusees both have similar chemical makeup, sulfur and potassium chlorate, The torpedoes may have more oxidizer and the fusees have a little strontium for color. I remember the local druggist's kid mixing up sulfur with something and getting a little on a hammer and smacking it against a piece of steel to set it off. You could see the smoke and hear it pop but it wasnt much louder than the steel and hammer hitting together.

Jimmie

[Doug Miller]

That's fine -- as long as you pick ones that know what they're talking about. These guys don't appear to.

[gfretwell]

I wondered about that too. In fact they did have a small "hand held" fusee that burned 5 minutes along with the 15 and 20 minute ones with the spike in the end. Those came in red and green. The green ones never made it to the civilian market but you can buy the red ones at the auto parts store (AKA highway flares)