Radiant HEating? Outside?

Can anyone recommend a good site on how to add radiant heat to an outside, sidewalk. I want to add a 100' side walk to my shop to keep me out of the mud and wet grass and am interested in the pro's and con's of heating so that I do not have to shovel...
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HotRod wrote:

outside,
the
so
Hot topic, as I've posted a few messages here lately. Here's what I found:
http://www.warmzone.com /
They can retrofit your sidewalk for heating.
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HotRod writes:

You want to heat the outdoors, or a least a little patch of it. I hope you have deep pockets.
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HotRod wrote:

Before you invest in the hardware, find out how much this is going to cost to operate. It is very expensive.
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I recall seeing that it is even illegal to heat a driveway or sidewalk, but I sure don't know that for a fact. (could be some leftover trivia from the energy crisis) To operate it, I'd say you'd have to hit the lottery or be the CEO of a major corporation. A big snowblower would pay for itself in a year.
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Edwin Pawlowski wrote:

I would not be surprised if it is illegal in some locations. We have them were I live, including government buildings.
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you'd
big
have
Why in the world would it be illegal?
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snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

Same reason the old style 3 gallon flush toilets are illegal.
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Edwin Pawlowski wrote:

keep
going to

sidewalk, but

from the

or be

itself in a

According to these guys, it's not that much:
http://www.warmzone.com/questions-heated-driveways.asp
Q: What are the operational costs of your snow melting systems?
A: The average operational cost for a snow melting system is approximately $0.28 per 100 square feet per hour. This figure is based on a system producing 28 watts/sq.ft. with a kwh rate of $0.10 per hour. If you know the square feet of the area you want to heat, and your kwh rate, you can calculate the operational costs with this formula: heatable sq.ft. times watts/sq.ft.,d ivided by 1000, times your kwh rate.
Remember, these systems don't run continuously, and you can even get sensors that will determine if 1) it's cold enough and 2) there's moisture.
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On 14 Jan 2005 12:17:41 -0800, snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

Roughly speaking, that sounds like the 100 foot sidewalk the OP proposes would cost around $1 an hour, or $24 a day during cold weather. Just one week of cold and wet would cost $168. Having a solid week of cold and wet is a common thing in some locales.
BB
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BinaryBillTheSai...@Sea++.com wrote:

an
and
lottery
based
solid
Ok, here in detroit, 1kwh is $.07885 as of today http://my.dteenergy.com/myAccount/pdfs/rates.pdf
So for 100 sq ft area at 28 watts
100 * 28 /1000 * 7.885 = $.22 / hr
Bout 1/4 of what you calculated.
Wet and cold continuously for a week? Where? Usually when it snows here, it snows for a couple of hours. We had a big one last week, and it snowed for maybe 12 hours. Guess it depends where you live.
If you pay for your snow removal, I think it could pay for itself.. You'd have to figure out the numbers for yourself.
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snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

Unless I am misreading my reference, I am paying bout $2.00 per KWH .

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-snip-

I think you might be. Take your bill and divide the total by the number of Kilowatthours. [There is probably a "Your electricity costs $.xx/kwh, but on my bill it only represents about 2/3d of the cost. The other 1/3 is taxes, surcharges, etc]
BTW- mine, Niagra Mohawk in NY is about 13cents/kwh.
Jim
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Jim Elbrecht wrote:

I don't have a bill, everything is electronic and all I see is the final charges unless I really want to hut it up. I found the rate on the companies web site.
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-snip-

What electric company?
Jim
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Jim Elbrecht wrote:

AEP (aka American Electric Power)
http://www.aepcustomer.com/tariffs/Ohio/default.htm Monthly Rate (Schedule Code 820)
Summer Winter
First 800 KWH 2.54439 2.54439
All KWH Over 800 KWH 2.54439 1.95956
Of course this was buried in a 114 page document and I may have picked up the wrong information.
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-snip-

I don't know what that was-- I got lost before I figured it out. [maybe it is a a 'per bill' charge--- or is it in cents/kwh as they list it below?]
I did find this page- http://www.aepcustomer.com/tariffs/Ohio/pdf/COMP-OP-UnbundledTariffBook12-17-03.pdf
page 38 of 135- rates for residential, - the highest rate is [in cents] Generation 3.4 transmission .4 distribution 2.4 total of 6.14 cents per kwh. [there are probably taxes & fees that get added in, but your final cost is probably around a dime a kwh]
BTW--- I can't imagine not having access to my kwh usage per month. A sudden jump in cost might just mean they read the meter wrong, or on a different day--- or I might see that my usage jumped 20% because some appliance was malfunctioning or I had a wiring problem.
Jim
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I don't have deep pockets what I have is a shop located way behind the house that is almost inaccessible in the winter, the driveway leading to the shop is to steep to drive on and my attempts to add gravel and such haven't worked. I also do not have a side walk which means I trek through the snow or puddles and mud to get there and my work back to the house. I'm just interested in getting a quote and finding out what the cost of heating is.
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The cost is whatever it costs for the hardware, plus the cost to run it.
It might not cost too much to operate if you only use it on an as-needed basis. I would not go with the optional sensors which turn the system on whenever the sensors determine there "might" be a need.
And If I cam home to 3' of snow on my sidewalk, I wouldn't expect to clear it with the flip of a switch.
snipped-for-privacy@aol.com
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I believe here in Ontario the government picks up some of the cost of electrical so if I'm correct we currently pay about 5 cent per kwh, I'll have to double check that though. I looked at the OPG (http://www.opgdirect.com /) website but they only had cost per MWH.
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