This one is dimmable, although I know not about its noise level when it
is dimmed. $14.99, 930 lumens - roughly the same light output as a 60
You may be an exception to the rule, equipping all your wall switches
with dimmers. At $15 or so a switch that certainly adds up over a whole
The discussion about price of light bulbs did not involve dimmers until
YOU brought that up.
The original author wanted a 150W bulb and was dismayed at the price
difference between 75W-100W bulbs and the 150W bulb. I checked at
Walmart and yes the 150W bulb is much more expensive than a 75W or
100W. 4 packs of each of these are only a bit more than the price of a
SINGLE 150W bulb.
A single CF rated for 2600 lumens (150W equiv) with color temp of 5000
Kelvin for accurate color fidelity only uses 40W of electricity, is
rated for 10,000 hour life, is 6.7 inches long and 2.68 inches wide
(fits most lamps) and costs about $10. As I recall the 150W bulb at
Walmart was about $2.75, and you will replace it 5 or more times in the
life of a similar lamp equipped with this bulb.
This is the CF that I am discussing above.
YMMV of course. I have some CFs in my house that have had daily use for
over 10 years without a single replacement. Yes some do not last that
long, but even the short life ones are YEARS before they need
replacing. Few of the CFs in my house are the short spiral, we bought a
pack of 6 of them 3 years ago to replace twin tubes that were starting
to fail after 8-10 years of service.
There are only 3 incandescent lamps now in the house, installed in
reflector floods, they get very little or no useage at all.
I can actually measure the lifespan of some of my CFLs in decades (the
7 and 9 watt Philips PL models I bought back in 1984) and others
literally minutes -- in the case, all Lights of America.
I bought six Philips SLS20 CFLs back in the 1997 and five of the six
are still going strong (the other one was dropped). They're
noticeably dimmer now and you can clearly see how the phosphorous
coating has blackened and become pitted, but even after 15,000 or more
hours of use, they continue to run.
If you stick with Philips, Osram Sylvania or GE, you shouldn't be
On Fri, 07 Apr 2006 19:58:09 GMT, Paul M. Eldridge
more than a couple years.
I use them because they do last longer than incandescents & save a few
KWh of electricity.
Won't fit inside some glass covers.
Some are noisy.
Some don't give full light for a few minutes.
They are expensive- even if the electrical savings are calcuted at
I wonder if this ties back to my earlier comment regarding brand.
I've had exceptionally good luck with Philips and Osram Sylvania and
an absolutely disastrous experience with Lights of America (I don't
know if they're any better today, as I stopped buying their products
some fifteen years ago).
It seems the technology continues to improve, year by year, and with
the introduction of the new "mini-twist" CFLs, some of these lamps are
now actually physically smaller than the incandescent bulbs they
replace. And I believe any products that are "Energy Star" certified
must meet specific standards in terms of energy efficiency, operating
performance and service life. But, generally speaking, electronic
ballasts should eliminate any issues with flicker and ballast noise,
and CFLs that employ amalgam technology work much better over a wide
range of temperatures and reach full brightness in much less time.
Lastly, the cost of CFLs has fallen dramatically over time and this
trend, if it should continue, combined with steadily rising power
rates, should make CFLs increasingly more popular.
Tuesday/Wednesday in 6400K color temp. The lamps are just under 5" tall
and about 2 inches wide. They fit ANYWHERE a 60W or 75W incandescent
bulb would fit. Similar bulbs at Walmart (although not 6400K) are a bit
higher, but under $3 each.
To get Phillips and Osram brands will require selective shopping as the
only places I can recall seeing them is at Home Deport and/or Lowes.
I just tested a newly installed 13W mini twist (GE brand - made in
china). From flipping the switch to full brightness was about 3-5
seconds. This design is several years old, and the current year models
are even faster to turn on.
Cost per lamp is $2.10
6400K raises a red flag - I have seen that more than anywhere else as a
claim of "dollar store" compact fluorescents! I have *BIGTIME* experience
with these *consistently* having brightness about or somewhat less than
that of 40 watt standard incandescents, even when claimed incandescent
replacement is as high as 150 watts, even when nomimal wattage is 36 watts
(should be good for well-outshining a 100 watt incandescent or halogen),
even when claimed lumens exceed 1300 (a "standard" 75 watt incandescent is
1190 or so).
Also, I have seen 6400K dollar store ones have color over a range of
6500 to 8000. Be aware that 6400, 6500 and 8000 are all minor variations
of "bluish icy cold slightly-bluer-than-pure-white" with higher color
temp. being more-bluish.
Often but not always I see 6-packs of compact fluorescents at Home Depot
I think these are good places to get such things - as well as Target.
Even when a 4-pack costs $15, even in a severe bad case where a 15 watt
compact fluorescent dies as quickly as a 60 watt incandescent, at
USA-average residential electricity rate one saves $4.50 per bulb!
- Don Klipstein ( firstname.lastname@example.org)
with FEII as a part of the part number.
Feit gives a good graphic of color temps on its web site.
Incandescent/candle/normal CF is about 2700K
Halogens come in at about 3200K
Cloudless day is about 5500K
partially overcast day is about 6500K
the whitest area of the chart is around 4000K, so YES 5000K and 6400K
lamps will be slightly to somewhat blue.
Feit calls their lamps standard, Cool White, and Daylight. 1000bulbs
shows 2700/500/6400K color temps all with the same base PN
FC15/FEIIS15Wxx where xx is the color temp 27/5/64
I do not shop dollar stores for CFs. Only big box and internet sites.
But one little catch: The requirement even has some for color - which
should be good!
I believe part of the color requirement is color rendering index - which
"old tech" cool warm white and warm white would not meet, but compact
fluorescents normally meet - unless they are of the types usually seen in
Another part is in overall color. I have heard of a specific
requirement of 2700-3000 Kelvin so as to have color temperature like that
of incandescents and halogens.
Here is where I see the glitch: 3200K or 3500K is disqualified, while
not being disqualified is a minor deviation from "incandescent color" in
the direction of greenish or pinkish-purplish.
I and probably many others would like compact fluorescents that are
whiter than the very orange-yellow shade of incandescents as well as
compact fluorescents trying to match them in color. Not the 4100K "cool
white color", nor the ice-cold-pure-white 5000K (actually roughly typical
of midday tropical sunlight), nor the even-more-bluish 6500K, but a
"semi-warm-white" or "whitened-incandescent" like the color of projector
lamps and photoflood lamps and movie lights - mid-3000's Kelvin! 3500 is
one that compact fluorescents are available in and I do like that one, but
it is disqualified from energy-star so much less common than
Back to most color complaints: It appears to me that most color
complaints come from a mixture of lights having noticeably different
colors, with one being "the newfangled kind". Especially when one is more
greenish and the other is more pinkish-purplish, and typically bias is
against whatever is "newfangled" or whatever is more greenish - double
whammy if a compact fluorescent should glow with the color of a gas mantle
- which is why I suspect compact fluorescents and warm-color fluorescents
in general are more likely to be purplish-pinkish than greenish.
Now for good color easily-available compact fluorescents:
If you don't like pinkish-purplish, then favor lower wattages, and types
with integral electronic ballasts, and especially spirals since those tend
to have integral electronic balasts and have some brands doing well in
that color area. I have seen good results with Philips and Commercial
Electric and Feit Electric in this area. Philips should be good for
more-starts duty. Commercial Electric equivalent to 60W incandescent (14
watts) is even slightly more greenish-yellow than incandescent in my
experience - but that could make them look ugly if mixed with others or
even with incandescents if your are touchy about that - maybe best to use
only the same model for every socket in your dining room fixture!
If you don't like greenish and are so greenish-phobic that you don't
mind a slight bit of pinkish-purplish, then good would be:
* Sylvania 3000K models - not only slightly whiter than most, but also in
my experience slightly pinkish-purplish and I suspect the reason is
"greenish-phobia". These could look a little harsh in color by being a
bit whiter and pinkish-purplish, but color rendition is actually good!
* Higher wattages, especially 26 watts or more. Keep in mind heat
issues, especially in small enclosed fixtures and recessed ceiling
* Philips SLS of at least 23 watts. Lower wattages of Philips SLS I find
to approximate incandescent well and higher wattages I dind to be very
* Spirals of size unusually compact for their wattage (more when wattage
is 19 watts or more) tend to be a bit more pinkish and less greenish.
* PL-13/F13TT, PLC-13 or 26 / F13 or 26 DTT with magnetic ballasts in my
experience tend to have their deviations-from-incandescent towards
pinkish rather than greenish. Exception: Osram F13DTT/27K, an older
model, appears to me dead-on incandescent rather than pinkish.
- Don Klipstein ( email@example.com)
I agree with most of this, except 150 watt I would note as
incandescent-equivalent and requiring 42-55 watts of compact fluorescent
Also, about 5000K being a good color for home use - this is a stark icy
cold pure white close to the color of noontime sunlight with unpolluted
air in a tropical area - slightly more bluish than "cool white
Yes, there are some that big, and they are big, and I suspect major
fixture heating issues - worse even for the bulbs than for the fixtures.
Those problems get down to a dull roar when the compact fluorescent
wattage is only 26 watts, with light output like that of 100 watt
incandescent when things are going well.
I find true only in a couple specific cases:
1. Illuminating areas so large that you have some need of functiobning of
night vision - such as large warehouses or yards outdoors at nighttime -
the high color temperature has a spectrum favorable to stimulating night
vision. Along with the existance of expectation that "dreary gray"
illumination is an improvement over "dreary dim".
2. At illumination levels around or above the 1100-2000 lux typical of
offices and classrooms.
Otherwise, high color temperatures of 4100K and above can have a "dreary
gray" effect only partially mitigated by high color rendering index.
Sun at zenith in a pollution-free area at sea level is 5400 Kelvin. Sun
at high noon on a June day with especially strong wind flow of incoming
especially-low-pullution air in Washington DC is 5200 Kelvin. Sunlight
above the atmosphere is 5700-5800 Kelvin.
5000K often appears slightly bluish. Yes, I do see how the sun often
manages to have higher color temperature (more bluish) than cool white
fluorescent of 4100-4300 Kelvin and such sunlight does not appear bluish,
but 5000K fluorescents tend to appear icy cold pure white to slightly
bluish. Part is from being in context, and part is from human vision
having a known tendency to prefer lower color temperature at lower
illumination levels that are typical for use indoors in homes. I, for
one, prefer 3500K.
Ideally, I surely like for home use 3600-3700K of tungsten being pushed
to a hair short of immediate burnout, or carbon arcs which are roughly
3800-3900K - but these are obviously impractical - but next down my
favorite list is 3500K, a "whiter shade of halogenlike but still warm", a
standard color temperature of triphosphor fluorescent lamps and a few
compacts are available in that color. Next standard one higher is 4100K -
the "cool white color", and available with high color rendering index,
with compacts normally having color rendering index of 82. But that gets
to be a bit on the "stark white" side in most home use. And I thought I
more than average liked my lights whiter than incandescent!
Keep an eye on what Home Depot is offering. Somewhat often they have
promotional 6-packs of 60-watt-equivalent for $10 with no shipping charge!
Target has equivalents to 60, 75 and 100 watts at about $15 per 4-pack
But if you have a more special need or want to get case quantity
pricing, chances are the online suppliers are the best deal. But be aware
of the color temperature and have this awareness when the bulb is not
"the usual color temperature" of 2700, 2800 or 3000 Kelvin (roughly
- Don Klipstein ( firstname.lastname@example.org)
for approx same light output about 2600 lumens. Our color preferences
are different. I live is a HOT climate, so a COLD appearing light with
bluish overtones is psychologically GREAT!!
large area lighting in warehouse/box store lighting and therapeutic
applications. I am NOT advocating its use in normal residential
applications. It won't screw into a standard fixture as it has a Mogul
base. Mogul bases are common in the lighting systems used in the big
box stores, especially if they use something other that linear fluorescents.
applications, in part because of where we live. A cool light is a
psychological boost in a HOT climate. I wear shorts, sandals, and tee
shirts YEAR ROUND. Natural fiber clothing is ALWAYS preferable because
it wicks away perspiration MUCH better.
What do you mean by justification? That's the way the manufacturing
and market system works, economies of scale.
If they were trying to gouge us, wouldn't they gouge us on the smaller
sizes that people buy most of the time? Instead of on the ones we
almost never buy.
Especially now with Polish and Hungarian and Chinese lightbulbs on the
market. Is anyone trying to compete with US made 150 and if so, what
percentage of their 100W bulb price do they charge for 150?
I thought a 150 watt bulb costs a mediumish-low price of a 4-pack of
100-watt ones (maybe $1.75), and a 50-100-150 watt costs much more still -
a little below the $3-$3.50 supermarket price of a 4-pack of 100 watt
It appears to me that supermarkets need to make money from 25-100 watt
lightbulbs in order to pay the rent on shelf space for the 150 watt ones
that need to be displayed because supermarkets would lose customer loyalty
without 150 watt lightbulbs, and also to pay for what they have to give
out in pre-Thanksgiving prime shopping period in order to build or
maintain year-round market share.
Ever notice that supermarkets often don't even have 200 watt lightbulbs?
Ever see supermarkets with 300 watt ones - even home centers often don't
sell those, but many hardware stores do!
- Don Klipstein ( email@example.com)
multiple brands offered, and is parked at eye level. 75W, 60W are in
the same general area, again multiple shelves, mutiple brands. As I
recall, at least two full units of rack space, floor to top shelf were
devoted to the 60W-75W-100W incandescents
150W had 4 TOTAL bulbs in the store partially hidden by some literature
hanging from a vertical riser. Hanging right above them were the
compact spiral CFs
But as with the 'invention' of television, by Baird in Britain it was later
claimed by others, including Russia.
The 'invention' and use of radar; originally called 'Radiolocation', by the
British in 1939 (Battle of Britain etc.) Then invention of the radar
magnetron, now used in microwave ovens, by Watson-Watt a Scotsman and so on!
Alexander Graham Bell, another Scotsman who emigrated to Canada is credited
with 'invention' of the voice telephone.
Price of a standard base 7 1/2 W I just bought was $2.49, same as 4 60s;
for the same reasons given here previously: low volume.
* Normal people believe if it aint broke, don't fix it. Engineers believe
if it aint broke, they didn't build enough improvements into it.*
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