Portable Home Generator Questions

[HeyBub]

## Money is easier to store than gasoline. Hurricane Yikes made a believer out of us regarding sufficient fuel on hand (every gas station for 60 miles was without power to pump fuel). We now have oodles of gas cans and plan, when the forecast is for bad weather (hurricanes for us, ice storms for you), to get them filled in advance of the storm. We figure, after the storm passes, we can use the gasoline for our vehicles.

## If you go for propane or diesel, you'll have to muster a different strategy.

## If your generator uses one gallon per hour of gasoline, I'd think 50 gallons would be sufficient. First, you won't be using the generator 24/7 - there will be times - like when you're sleeping - you'll shut it down or you can have 'roaming blackouts,' two hours on, one hour off, or other rationing techniques. Second, when you get down to your last five or six gallons, you can forage for more fuel.

## The number of circuits and so forth is handled by your transfer switch; there will be ONE cable from the generator to your distribution panel. You can have a cable custom made, but cables do come in standard lengths (10',

25', 50', etc.). They ain't cheap!

## The 120v outlets on the generator are for use at a construction site or similar where there is NO distribution panel. The builders plug their saws and compressors directly into the generator. For emergency power, as in your situation, these outlets on the generator are typically not used.

## Footnotes:

1. Plan on some method of anchoring your generator against theft.
2. A couple of 100' extension cords are nice so you can accommodate your neighbor's minimal electrical needs (refrigerator, TV,...).
3. Generators are generally louder than the hinges on the gates of Hell. If you DO pay a premium for a quiet one, its only advantage is that you can better hear your neighbors' loud generators.
4. In these difficult financial times, I see several ads for generators on Craigslist at substantial savings. People seemingly are turning their seldom used assets into cash. You might find a bargain.
5. You can dispense with the transfer switch by adding a double 50-amp circuit breaker to your panel and wiring it to an external plug. If you do this, you'll need an interlock (Google for) to fit your panel. The interlock switch prevents the mains to the pole from being energized by your generator.

[James]

HeyBub, your comments are very very helpful and informative. Many thanks !!

James

[Jay-T]

I have always wondered why states (especially those prone to hurricanes, storms, snow storms) do not require that ALL gas stations have a simple backup generator so they can pump the gas that is in their tanks. And, of course, once the generator is started they can use their own gas pumps to keep filling their generator gas tank to keep it running.

I always think how stupid it is in a natural disaster emergency that people who need to evacuate can't get gas because the gas at the gas stations is unavailable simply because the gas station doesn't have the power to pump its own gas.

[ransley]

Not only that but they dont make any money when they have no power.

[Chuck]

Most stations here in South Fl. have added there own generators. They learned a lesson after the 3 big ones a few years ago. I still have 40 gals. locked in my shed.

[Jay-T]

Not only that but they dont make any money when they have no power.

+++++++++++

It just seems like a no-brainer to me. Gasoline at gas stations is a vital commodity in a disaster and no-power situation. It could even apply in certain "homeland security" (what a joke that is) situations, so they could spend homeland security funds to help gas station owners pay for the initial generator setups.

And, the states could even impose certain no-gouging and even-distribution laws that they could put into effect in a declared emergency. They could authorize, for example, that in declared emergency situations the gas stations could charge an additional $1.00 or so per gallon as an incentive for them to stay open at least until they run out of gas, and re-open when they get more gas if the emergency still exists and the power is still out. And, the emergency regs could limit the size of the fill-up per vehicle to 5 or 10 gallons each. That would help prevent all of the gas stations at the very epicenter of the disaster from selling out all of their gas to too few people. By limiting the size of the fill-up, people would be dispersed at to a wider geographic area and could refill their tanks when they are perhaps 100 miles further away from the disaster center.

[PeterD]

Diesel beats both gas and propane/lpg/nat-gas hands down. Diesel also stores more easily, and most diesel generators run just fine on home heating fuel. Down side? Diesels are a bit noiser perhaps. Upsides? Good storage on the fuel (doesn't degrade in storage, but may require an algicide).

Safely? Hard, you need a good/proper storage tank. Consider checking Northern Tools for tanks.

How are you going to rotage 150 gallons of gas? If it is stale, you sure you want to put it in your car?

No, a gallon of propane has less energy than a gallon of gas. And a gallon of gas has less energy than a gallon of diesel.

No, but your question says you need to talk to an electrican about hookups before you kill yourself or someone else.

Probably, but I doubt you will get away with that type of a setup. I don't think any gas company will fill a tank (150 gallons) feeding a

150 ft line to a generator.

The very best one you can afford. NO cheap Chinese crap!!!

>

[HeyBub]

Duh!

The legislature in Texas passed a law recently (in light of the highway confusion occasioned by people trying to flee Hurricane Rita), that gas stations on official evacuation routes had to top off their storage tanks to at least 80% capacity. The law made no mention of emergency power to run the pumps.

I've considered getting another generator, appropriate cables and tools, and just waiting for the next emergency. I'd then toot up to the biggest gas station that was just sitting there in the dark, the owner or manager weeping, and offering to power-up his business for, oh, say $50/hour.

[PeterD]

Many states/locals do require certain key stations to have backup power. Not all stations, but some.

[PeterD]

It can happen, if the engine is not allowed to fully warm up during the test runs. Diesels can also 'cold stack' if run without a load for an extended period of time. (some are more prone to doing this than others, but generally any emergency generator should be run under load when exercising it, to ensure that the entire system works properly).

[Bill]

Search google.com for the words...

"Electronics friendly" generator

(Including quotes.)

[aemeijers]

You are rotating your stock, right? Even in brand new non-cruddy cans, it does not store real well. Pour a can in the car, go top off the car with fresh, refill the can, lather, rinse, repeat. I don't know what the specs say, but emergency gas over a year old would not give me a warm fuzzy feeling.

-- aem sends...

[Stormin Mormon]

Natural gas is highly dependable in NY. A natural gas generator makes sense. Or as you say, you can use your own gasoline to power the generator.

The answer, in part. Is that the government and the anti-gouging laws. I've heard that gas stations make nearly no mark up on fuel. Which is why most of them sell coffee, candy, beer, etc. Supposing a gas station installs a generator, and has it wired in. How do they recover the cost of the generator? Well, the only way I know is to sell gasoline during a power cut. But, is that actually cost effective? I doubt it. Even if they have cars lined up, the once a year or so doesn't provide enough mark up to cover the generator. Unless they increase the price of gas during the power cut. But they "aren't allowed" to do that. So, the stations say never mind, there is no financial reason to do so.

Requiring them by force of law, to spend money on generators. Well, that sounds like more big government telling people to do what's not financially practical. If there was good financial reason to install generators, they would have done so already.

I'd rather repeal the price gouging laws, and restore some of the freedom to the "free market". If they want to install a generator and charge ten bucks a galon during power cuts, that's fine with me. Don't want to pay ten bucks a galon? Fine. Go to some other gas station that's cheaper.

[Stormin Mormon]

If the gas stations could set their own price, I'm sure some would install generators.

[Stormin Mormon]

Must be worth the expense of the generator, then?

Please replace the gas every year. Pour the old stuff in your car, and buy new. Gasoline does go stale.

[Stormin Mormon]

I realize it's fun to play dictator, and dictate how the country should run. But, please remember that the free market and freedom is what made the USA great, in the past. And lack of freedom is much of USA's problems, now. Freedom, the market, profit, supply and demand. To me, that's the answer. Your "no brainer" demonstrates lack of brains. Or maybe lack of understanding how the USA used to work.

[Stormin Mormon]

Now, that's the free market in action. Find the demand, meet the need. Charge appropriately.

You can expect the business owner to reply "Well, we've got all these expensive electronic pumps, and I don't want to risk them getting fried."

[Jay-T]

Yep, that's me -- no brains and a lack of understanding of how the USA used to work.

I am so glad that I have people like you around that can guide me and help me with that. Oops, I forgot, I have no brains, so maybe having people like you around is not a good thing. Gee, I'm so confused.

[Jim Rusling]

I put Stabil in all my gas cans. I use the gas for the mowers and it seldom get over 5 months old. When you exercise the generator, you need to have some load on it. I use a portable heater for this purpose. You also need to let it run long enough to reach full operating temperature. After you shut it down, top off the fuel tank. don't forget to change the oil at least once a year.

[ransley]

de quoted text -

He would make so much money charging extra and selling his tanks fast you could charge 500$ an hour and get it.