Wow, that is very interesting. Not using a primer on bare wood goes against everything I've ever heard on the topic. My personal experience is that the oil primer holds and the paint wears off. I pretty much just accept that my porch needs to be top coated every two years. I've always assumed that porch floor coating is an area that modern materials science still hasn't found the ideal solution for.
I know with oil primer that's it's crucial that your wood be bone dry. Any moisture will interfere with adhesion and penetration. This is often a problem with horizontal wood, especially when it's not properly sloped and shaded from direct sunlight by a porch roof.
I wouldn't mind topcoating the porch floor every two years, just as long as I didn't have to get down on my hands and knees for hours scraping off blistering primer. What a mess!
What oil primer did you use, and what kind of wood do you have?
I'm not sure I remember, but I'm guessing it was just Sears Weatherbeater oil because that's what I have in my basement at the moment. I usually use that for exterior priming, although I understand that BM makes a much better product. As for the wood type, again, I'm not sure. I'm guessing it's just ordinary tongue and groove pine.
If you really want to make your paint job last, you might look into some industrial priming solutions. There's something called Aluthane that is supposed to be perfect for less than ideal wood surface conditions. From what I've read on it, it doesn't readily accept a latex top coat but a good scratch sanding might help that.
I just found a product by Wolman called "Woodlife Classic". It is a water-base clear wood sealer that is latex-paintable. I called Wolman tech support and they assured me that it is rated for horizontal surfaces with foot traffic.
Has anybody had any experience with this product? My intent would be to use it to seal the nooks and crannies in my weathered wood porch floor (e.g between boards and at the base of railing posts where they sit on the porch floor) before topcoating with a quality latex porch floor paint.
Are you suggesting that I can "prime" the bare wood with a transparent stain, and then put latex topcoat over that?
Well, everything I ever read or was told by "tech support" people is contrary to that (topcoating stain).
Nevertheless, several weeks ago I used Cabot semi-solid stain under a latex topcoat on some porch steps just to see how ot would hold up compared to past efforts. I'll have a pretty good idea next Spring.
I want to make sure I understand correctly what you are saying. Are you saying you put down transparent stain, then latex topcoat over that, on the deck surface?
I use "toner" stain (between clear and semi-transparent) on my deck and of course there's no peeling or blistering. I just have to re-apply ever couple of years. I don't mind that.
But on my exposed wrap-around porch, the previous owner had painted it to compliment the house color, so I don't have the option of reverting to stain. Stripping the entire porch back to bare wood is out of the question. It's over 60 feet long and 8 feet wide.
No. We don't paint outdoor decking/structure. The transparent (or opaque) stain _is_ the finish coat. When they wear thin, we just add another layer or two.
I've heard of Wolman but am not familiar with any specific products. I gether that you are intent on using a latex product for your application. If you would consider another type, I would recommend a good quality, exterior rated oil-based poly floor paint. Over bare wood many of these products recommend priming by simply using a slightly thinned coat of the same porduct. I have had good results and long wear from these on outdoor porches over the years.
Although, I recently heard that many such items are being taken off the market in my area for environmental reasons. Does that have anything to do with your need to use a latex floor paint?
No. The reason for preferring latex has to do with the particular application requirements. In my experience, oil-base products are VERY sensitive to moisture in the wood. With the exception of July and maybe August, it's difficult to find enough warm dry days in a row to make sure the wood is absolutely bone dry. Latex is far more forgiving with regard to slight moisture in the wood.
In over 25 years of professional painting experience I have used many brands of paint. Overall I prefer Benjamin Moore for many reasons. I actually end up saving money [even though the paint costs more per gallon than average paint] because I need less, I don't need to recoat to get a good hide. I recently tried Behr paint (homeowner bought it) and it was so bad I got a full refund for the client. I have had similar experience with Glidden, except their primers seem to be pretty good.
Rodda, Parker Paint, and Sherwin Williams are all "ok" paint but truly nothing comes close to Ben Moore.
A lot of folks have praised Benjamin Moore paint but they all seem to cite the same reason: it hides well. How well a paint "hides" during initial application is only one measure of the quality of the paint. Equally important, or arguably far more important, is how well does it hold up over time. How does the fading and peeling resistance of Benjamin Moore compare to the competition? That's tougher to answer, I know, but it's a more important consideration for many people than whether or not you have to go over it a second time.
I've never understood the "hides well" argument. I rarely change exterior colors so that's never a problem for re-painting, but for new wood, doesn't everyone use a primer the same color or a touch lighter than the final paint color? I'm painting my house a deep red (same as before) and California makes a colored primer called "Russet", which is a shade lighter than the paint. I'm getting fantastic results with one coat of primer and one coat of paint. We'll see how it lasts. Even when I couldn't get a pre-mixed colored primer I had tint added to the primer to make it the right shade. I've always done it this way. Isn't this standard practice? What am I missing? Hilary
All "ok" huh. Why don't you mention specifically which paint products you're talking about so we know what you're saying. For someone with 25 years of "professional" painting experience, you're about as vague as you can be. It's like saying Chevrolet cars are the fastest. Downright meaningless.
I consider myself INCREDIBLY lucky that the California paint distributor is closer to my house than any other brand name paint distributor or any big box store. The price is about $39/gallon, but hey, who cares about the cost of the paint when the real cost is the time and effort in prep. If it really lasts the 10 years Consumer Reports says it can, then it's money VERY well spent. The fact that it goes on smoothly with no drips or splatters and covers beautifully in one coat doesn't upset me either :) Hilary
I've heard the above claim for years that Benjamin Moore paint was the best.
As a professional landlord who does as much interior and exterior painting as many painting professionals, I just don't see it.
Benjamin Moore's interior paints are overpriced and don't perform as well as some lower prices varieties.
Their exterior paints are Ok - just OK in my opinion. I've had terrible luck with some of their porch and deck paints compared with other brands, and yes, I'm talking about using the same appication techniques.
For exterior stains, I've have found that the Behr 10 year solid color stains are excellent.
Some of the Benjamin Moore semi-gloss exterior trim paint that I've used weathered no better than the Gidden. But the Glidden was only 60% of the Benjamin Moore's price.
Professional painters have often bragged to me about the quality of the paint that they used or the quality of their jobs. However, do they truly go back to examine their work 3 or 5 years later?
I hired one such painter to do exterior work at one of my rental buildings. He used finish paint on bare wood without priming. He argued with me saying that his 25 years of experience proved his quality. I asked him for another reference. After driving to that reference where he had done the same thing on window sills (no primer), I noted that after just two years, his prior job was peeling on all the sills.
I then fired him...
Want an exterior paint job that will truly last? Prime the wood with pure linseed oil, wait the month it will take to dry and then finish with a top coat of oil paint. Of course, the above isn't too practical in most cases.... :-)
I had always thought oil paint best for exterior wood. But was told it is not as flexible as acrylic, so might crack/peel over time. I have to do ALL my wretched, miserable-looking window wood trim, so want best bang for my buck.
If your wood is BONE DRY, and you expect dry warm weather for an entire week after painting (NO rain or dew etc), and these are all non-foot-traffic surfaces (like window trim), and there are no exposed areas of the wood that could absorb moisture (like end cuts that are inaccessible to paint but water could get in there), then go with oil, even though it's messier to deal with.
Otherwise, use a high quality 100% acrylic latex; the glossier the better (as far as durability is concerned; if you need to hide imperfections then less glossy is better).
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