No, aluminized steel is eighties technology. Original exhaust on the '96 Mystique was stainless. Exhaust on my 2002 PT Cruiser is stainless. Exhaust on my daughter's Civic is stainless. Virtually every downpipe in the last 20 years is stainless.
Every exhaust I've replaced on my vehicles in the last 20+ years has been replaced with stainless
I was a dealer service manager for 10 years. At that time. aproxemately 10% of my 600+ regular customers' driving patterns fit the "normal" schedule, while about 70% were definitely "severe" and the other roughly 20% were borderline - or they met several of the requirements for "severe" at least part of the year. There is not just the two extremes - so some customers stretched the change interval part way - changing at 4000 miles (6000km) etc.
There ARE stainless steel exhaust systems available. I have personal experience with their application for at least 15 years now. In my
29 years experience as a fleet mechanic, supervisor, and manager, I have observed no tendency for stainless exhaust systems to crack at any greater frequency than non-stainless systems. An appropriate type of stainless steel is an excellent material for exhaust systems.
How about from the car manufacturer??? The manual for my 2002 PT Cruiser says Schedule "B" - 5000KM or 3000 miles oil change interval is required "If you usually operate your vehicle under one or more of the following conditions:
-Day or night temperatures below 32F (0C)
-Stop and go driving
-Extensive engine idling
-Driving in dusty conditions
-Short trips of less than 10 miles (16km)
-More than 50% of your driving is at sustained high speeds during hot weather, above 32C (90f)
-Trailer towing
-Taxi, delivery or police service (commercial use)
-If equiped for and running E85 fuel
NOTE - ONE OR MORE.
Well, I drive less than 16km per day, 90% of the time - and that is split into 2 or more trips - so I am DEFINITELY in the "Schedule B" category. During aproxemately 6 months per year night temperatures are below 0C, so EVERYONE in Waterloo falls into the "Schedule B" category half of the year. Anyone driving during rush hour is in gridlock for a good part of the comute - putting them in the "schedule B" category.
In the summer, if long distance commuting, a good part of the drive (say from Waterloo to Toronto) will be sustained high speed driving during the summer - which is also getting pretty close to "schedule B"
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My last car was a 2004 Toyota Camry. After the warranty expired, I changed the oil every 12 to 15 thousand miles. I drove the hell out of that thing and had over 180k on it when I got rid of it and never had any problems except replacing a windshield wiper motor. It even had the original brakes on it.
The car I had before that was a 1998 Subaru Forrester. Same oil change habits and bad driving habits with that one but I traded it in after
160k miles. I did have to get the timing chain idler pulley replaced once on that one tho. That one still had the original rear brakes when I got rid of it. I must not stop or slow down much. :)I hope I have similar luck with this 2009 Matrix I'm driving now.
-C-
This is a decent list. Nothing like it is in my owners manual. However it still has undefined words like "usually", and "extensive" that make it hard to determine if it applies. The first five of those apply to my driving sometimes, but the manufacturer's onboard computer still tells me to change at around 7000 miles. So my very typical driving does not apparently qualify as severe.
Some the auto manufacturers, GM being one, have gone "all in" with their oil life monitors. My '97 Lumina manual has 2 oil change schedules, similar to above, even though the car has a monitor. It says use the schedules to determine when to change the oil. The '98 Lumina manual doesn't have a schedule, and says go by the oil change light. These seem widespread now. You can find out how the monitors work by googling. The GM system uses engine inputs to an algorithm. I've seen that Mercedes uses a sensor to measure electrical conductivity. That might just be one part of their system.
I figured the GM system can't detect dust, and thought I had them on that. Nope. They mention that in the '98 Lumina manual and say to change at
3000 miles in dusty conditions. I'll continue doing 3-4k mile oil changes, but if the light comes on before that I'll go by the light. Not a big deal. The monitors are a good idea if people actually pay attention to them. Even girls usually ask somebody about it when a light come on. I've noticed my daughters mention check engine lights to me within a week or so of them going on. And I've heard people brag about doing 15k mile oil changes.--Vic
No, contrary to your assesment, MOST vehicles fall into the "severe service" according to Chrysler's definition, which is the same as most others.
Have you read what Clare as written? Perhaps most in So. Cal. are not driven in "severe service" but in much of the rest of the country they are, at least according to the manufacturer's definition of "severe service".
Why make up stuff? None of the auto manufacturers ever said any of that in describing the severe schedule. You're just inventing conditions to suit your own prejudice. BTW, I go MONTHS without getting on the highway. But in your world I suppose that's impossible. You have to look at the big picture, not just your little world.
snip
"Covered?" By who? You? What you made up is just bullshit, and shows you know nothing of engine operation, and nobody should follow your advice. Evaporation occurs from heat, not a "highway trip." Learn a little bit how a thermostat works. Engines get to operating temp without seeing a highway. I'm guessing that most cars newer than 10 years old don't even have a severe schedule. Starting in 1998 the Chevy Lumina manual didn't. They say go by the oil change light. The exception was dusty conditions, where they say 3000 miles. I'm not going to tell anybody when to change their oil. Up to them.
--Vic
Here, not often. Every other place I've lived, 80% of the time.
That's true of most cars.
In Alabama, no. In Vermont, you bet!
That sounds like Alabama in the summer, yes.
Truck, yes. Trailer, occasionally.
Always.
Yes, and you have to *USE* reason, too.
Why to you always say *never*. You should be saying "ever".
Ignore your owner's manual at your peril. You're wrong.
Look, you said a car doing a highway trip once a week excludes it from severe service because that evaporates moisture from the oil..
That's all I need to know you're basically a no-nothing about engines. You made that up. I have no problem understanding items on a "severe" list. I don't even know why you're talking about oil change "schedules." I drive Chevys. Since 1998 there is no schedule in the owner manuals I've seen. I already posted both schedules for my 1997 Lumina. The "severe" schedule reads nothing like the bullshit you made up, and my driving pattern qualifies for 3000 mile changes. Namely,
"Most trips are less than 5 to 10 miles (8 to 16 km). This is particularly important when outside temperatures are below freezing."
I've looked at 2 post-1997 Chevy manuals. The 1998 Lumina and the 2005 Malibu. Neither have oil change schedules. They both say go by the dash indicator. The 2005 Malibu instructions are below. If I get one of those I'll change the oil at 3-4k miles unless the change light comes on first. So what? I suppose most people will go by the light. That's okay too.
--Vic
2005 Malibu Engine Oil Life System When to Change Engine Oil Your vehicle has a computer system that lets you know when to change the engine oil and filter. This is based on engine revolutions and engine temperature, and not on mileage. Based on driving conditions, the mileage at which an oil change will be indicated can vary considerably. For the oil life system to work properly, you must reset the system every time the oil is changed. When the system has calculated that oil life has been diminished, it will indicate that an oil change is necessary. A Change Oil Soon message will come on. Change your oil as soon as possible within the next 600 miles (1 000 km). It is possible that, if you are driving under the best conditions, the oil life system may not indicate that an oil change is necessary for over a year. However, your engine oil and filter must be changed at least once a year and at this time the system must be reset. Your dealer has GM-trained service people who will perform this work using genuine GM parts and reset the system. It is also important to check your oil regularly and keep it at the proper level. If the system is ever reset accidentally, you must change your oil at 3,000 miles (5 000 km) since your last oil change. Remember to reset the oil life system whenever the oil is changed.
Many owner's manuals, including mine, don't include the definition of severe service. They say to change the oil when the engine oil monitor says to, or 7500 miles, whichever comes first. The later is apparently to cover the possibility of a failed monitor.
For my rather typical driving, which often includes some of the items on the severe service list, my monitor tells me to change oil at around 7000 miles.
"The List" is hard to apply to a specific car and driver. Intentionally, maybe.
No, those who claim the driving does not meet the definition of "severe" have their head stuck somewhere - either in the sand or somewhere darker.
The MANUFACTURER'S DEFINITION states if ANY of the following conditions are met -
ANY ONE
And in a very large part of the USA and Canada, MOST cars fall into at least TWO of those conditions most of the year. And you guys will be the ones bitching because your Chrysler /Honda / Toyota watever failed due to "coking" damage. It has GOT to be shitty engineering, or bad oil - cannot POSSIBLY be because you didn't follow the specified "extreme" oil change schedule. After all, you know SO MUCH MORE than the engineers at the manufacturer who SPECIFICALLY REQUIRED 3000 mile oil change intervals for your type of driving.
Remember - I was a service manager for 10 years (and a mechanic for a lot longer than that)- and the manufacturer REQUIRED 5000Km oil change intervals for "severe" conditions - and they spelled out VERY CLEARLY what constituted "Severe" conditions..A few customers complained, saying I was just trying to get them to spend more than they had to untill I sat them down and showed them the manual - explaining that if ANY ONE of those conditions was met, it was considered by Toyota to be "severe" - and they met 2 or more most of the year.
Customers who followed my (and Toyota's) recommendations NEVER suffered timing chain, oil pressure, oil consumption, or ANY other engine problems. I can not recall ONE failure over that 10 year period. We DID, however, do a fair number of timing chain/tensioner replacements - a few camshaft replacements due to wear, ring jobs due to high oil consumption and blowby (stuck rings) etc on cars that were not regularly serviced by us - and those who stretched their maintenance periods.
Definitely made a believer out of me.
Neither one of you understands what you're talking about.
As far as I'm concerned, anyone can change their oil as often ar as seldom as they want on their own cars.
Advising others to ignore the recommendations of the manufacturer, and go farther than recommended on an oil change is irresposible, at best.
As a professional mechanic, it was my responsibility to advise the customer to follow the proper maintenance schedule for their driving conditions.
When called on to check out a vehicle when someone is considereing buying it, ONE of the first things I want to see is the service record. If the change intervals are on the longish side a physical inspection of the engine - pulling a valve cover, etc. is required before I'll recommend the car. If it's clean as a whip inside it could still be a "buy" recommendation. Any signs of "crud" or excessive varnish, and it's a "no-go" or a serious reduction in price.
My own cars never go over 6000km or 6 months - which ever comes first (and it is generally the time that runs out first)
Hmmm, What's all this fuss about oil change. If you really take care of your engine, do a periodic oil analysis. It will tell the whole picture your engine. Today's oil is rather chemical soup> not like non-detergent single viscosity bygone day's oil. Formulating today's oil is quite a science.
That's not the only thing. The engine runs richer when cold - which means more gasoline in the oil. Not nearly as bad as in the days of carbs and chokes - but still a factor. Boiling the gas out of the oild does not totally eliminate the effects - and any acid deposited in the oil is only condensed - not removed. Again, there is less acid buildup today with lead free gasoline - but it is still an issue.
Add to this the FACT that engine bearings are smaller today, on the whole - and the effects of acid are amplified because of that - so the differences come close to balancing each other out.
Multi-Grade oil has no positive effect in this case. Multi-grade oils break down FASTER than single weight oils under extreme conditions - and non-detergent oils were gone before the 'sixties.
Not a myth - and not promoted exclusively by the oil change industry - it is REQUIRED (or at least strongly recommended) by the manufacturers.
The extended oil change capability is a marketing ploy - and a concession to the EPA. Everyone has to out-do the next guy in lowering the TCO (Total Cost of Ownership)
Which costs as much as, or more than, the oil change. And used oil, properly disposed of, reduces the amount of raw crude that needs to be converted to oil and other industrial used - and re-refining takes less energy and produces less polution than processing raw crude - to the point that the "extra oil used" is a whole lot less than many would have you believe, as is the "waste oil".
The standard USED to be every 1000 kiles for severe, 1500 for "normal"
Changing oil too often is a bit hard on the drain plug, but has no other detrimental effects on an engine. 3000 miles was determined BY THE MANUFACTURERS to be a safe oil change interval target.
Yes, it is a REAL science to make an oil "meet" all requirements, without exceeding them by enough to raise the cost. It is a REAL science to make an oil that protects the engine adequately without crossing the line with the EPA - giving enough extreme pressure protection without including too much zinc compounds, etc. It is a REAL science to make an engine oil reduce friction, flow without restriction, and still protect the engine - still meeting all other requirements.
In ABSOLUTE terms, many of the oils from a decade or two back are actually "better" oils than the oils sold today, when it comes to lubrication and engine protection.
AMEN! And i haven't used multi-viscosity oils since the mid 80's. Everything i own gets straight 30, year 'round. I'm a 30+ year ASE certified master technician, and i've seen the inside of plenty of engines. (except my own). Never needed to open one up.
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