The shooting a few days ago of a 12 year old black kid in Cleveland
is getting a lot less attention than the Ferguson incident.
This is the compete surveillance video. If you just watch the first
couple of mins and the last minute, those are the most relevant,
nothing significance in the rest.
It's another example of how doing dumb things can lead to bad
results. And it raises questions in how the police responded. From
what I can see so far, it's tragic and mistakes were likely made
in the response, but I doubt these cops are guilty of a crime.
The only reason it apparently is getting less attention is because
the kid did have a pellet pistol that looked exactly like a real gun.
But from a chance to comply with the cops, the kid had almost no
On Friday, November 28, 2014 8:36:09 AM UTC-8, Chuck wrote:
Fact: It was an 'air soft' gun, it should have had an orange piece on the muzzle but it was missing.
Air soft guns are not lethal weapons.
Bottom line. Wave around a thing that looks like a real gun, don't cry about the results.
On Friday, November 28, 2014 11:45:24 AM UTC-5, Harry K wrote:
That's what I heard reported too. That by law, a gun like that,
which looks like a real gun, is supposed to have an orange tip that
helps distinguish it from a real gun. The gun in this case didn't have
I posted a link a while back about a friend of mine who owns a bar. He
was held up at gun point so he drew his Glock and killed one of the
It later turned out to be a BB rifle ...but a split second decision in a
dark bar would not have been sufficient to have known that.
If someone pulls a gun on you, you certainly have the right to blow them
away. No charges were filed against my friend. One of the would-be
robbers who got away was arrested a few weeks later for a robbery and he
had a real gun
There was a great scene in Breaking Bad where drug dealers were fighting
over turf and a little kid rides up to a dealer on a bicycle, pulls a
gun and shoots the drug dealer. If you are a cop and anybody points a
gun at you, you shoot him, not first check his age.
On Friday, November 28, 2014 12:42:54 PM UTC-5, Thane wrote:
No one said it was. First problem is that the cop who shot him had
a couple of seconds to try to guess the perp's age. You good at
ascertaining the age fr a moving suspect, whether the gun is real
or not and their intent?
Really? If you had what looks to be a real gun pointed at you, what
would your reaction be? How were the police to determine in a split
second if it was a toy or if they would be shot?
You have a half second to determine it you are going to live or die.
What is your decision?
There have been instances were the orange band was properly displayed and
LEO have shot anyway. In that case the justification was that the kid
didn't look like a kid.
My kids and gran kids know how to use and respect guns. We have no toy guns
in our house. Too easy for accidents to happen.
On Fri, 28 Nov 2014 07:24:04 -0800 (PST), trader_4
The cops "tactics" were incredibly stupid. A mere 1.5 seconds from
when they rolled up till they plugged the kid with a toy gun. There
idiotic tactics will be ignored and they will suffer no punishment for
killing a 12 year old. If some citizen with a legal firearm had done
exactly what the cops did, knowing nothing more then the cops did at
the time, what would have happened to that citizen? We all know with
100% certainty he'd have been locked up immediately and charged with
manslaughter at the very least for doing something so stupid as to
zoom up to within 20 feet of someone reported to be "20 year old black
man with gun", jump out of their car with gun drawn and within 1.5
seconds killing the "20 year old black man with gun" who had not even
pointed it at them. But this was cops so it's open season on mere
On Friday, November 28, 2014 1:47:42 PM UTC-8, Ashton Crusher wrote:
So you are facing someone you know is armed and see him pulling a gun. How long are YOU going to wait to shoot? Or are you one of those that think a cop shouldn't shoot at all until the opponent has fired one shot?
On Fri, 28 Nov 2014 10:46:06 -0800 (PST), trader_4
He only had "a couple seconds" because they stupidly zoomed up to 20
feet away in their car, leaped out, spent 1 second yelling "drop the
gun" or whatever, and 0.5 seconds killing the kid for not complying.
Most likely all this while the cars engine was running and the kid no
even able to tell what the cop was saying. A citizen who acted as
stupid as these cops did would be convicted of manslaughter.
On Friday, November 28, 2014 4:49:57 PM UTC-5, Ashton Crusher wrote:
Prove that please. So far, we don't even know exactly what the two
cops saw, what they knew, what they were intending to do. And from
the video, if the kid had stayed at the gazebo instead of moving
*toward* the police car, the outcome would likely have been very different.
Also factor in that a civilian it's not tasked with responding to calls
with guys pointing guns at people in public. Police are.
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