OT Short of news in the UK

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On 3/26/2012 7:17 AM, Han wrote:

Me, I'm just sitting back and enjoying the circus of fools while the truth comes out one tiny bit at a time. I've been robbed at gunpoint by little "BLACK" angels so I'll withhold judgment until all the facts are revealed. Personally, I wouldn't hesitate to aim for the mouth of an attacker and perform a double tap no matter who's little angel it is.
TDD
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Han wrote:

As long as you don't fall into the trap that every death is a tragedy. Some deaths are cause for celebration, revelry, and praise.
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It's all Bush's fault?
Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .
wrote:

If this is really an attempt to inject logic into a Usenet thread, I am going to have to ask you to leave the area immediately. (g).
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On 3/26/2012 7:54 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

You have to ask?
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Sigh. Of course it is. Even though it happened on Zero's watch. Especially since it's a black kid who got shot. That proves it.
Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .
"gonjah" <gonjah.net> wrote in message
On 3/26/2012 7:54 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

You have to ask?
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Kurt Ullman wrote:

I have a right to be here and will defend that right, without retreating, using deadly force if necessary.
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you can find links to official police reports,etc, on the Wiki page for Trayvon Martin. there's a great deal of information there.
since NO ONE was present at the actual scene of the shooting,no one has "personal knowledge" of the circumstances.
I live only 15 miles away from Sanford,and read the Orlando Sentinel daily,FWIW..... :-) I'm actually familiar with Sanford,and know what their crime is like.
we ALL have to go by the physical evidence and witness statements,and minding the presumption of innocence for Mr.Zimmerman,the accused. it's "innocent until PROVEN guilty",not "assumed guilty until proven innocent".
that is MY and many other peoples biggest complaint about this,the automatic presumption of guilt on Mr.Z.
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Seems a priori unlikely.

Yes, I can perfectly see how one can be suspicious. I am too if I see someone who does not belong in my neighborhood, but I won't go chasing a kid in the dark with a gun in my hand. And luckily, the police will be here in minutes if I call them. I have a cell phone and can stay back far enough without losing sight of the individual. It hasn't yet been necessary.
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Han
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Another part to this that makes no sense is that Zimmerman told police that Martin was acting like he was on drugs or something and that he had his hand in his waistband. If that is true, what idiot would get out of his car and confront him instead of just waiting for police to arrive? I think it's safe to assume that by the waistband comment Zimmerman was implying that he could have a weapon. If the kid was assaulting someone or about to set fire to a house, then it would make sense to take some action. But it would seem more likely that Zimmerman didn't really think he could have a weapon, but wanted to go play cop.
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On Mon, 26 Mar 2012 18:23:40 -0500, "Attila.Iskander"

Han loves the strawman argument.

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On Sat, 24 Mar 2012 06:45:21 -0700 (PDT), " snipped-for-privacy@optonline.net"
in

It would be prudent to listen to the evidence, no?

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Who says? The Long Island police? Well, duh!
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It's what the police everywhere says about citizen neighborhood watch patrols, or whatever they're called. No weapons, walk in pairs.
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Han
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Ah, so now you have personal experience with *every* police force in the country? Please, go on...
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Perhaps, but you should be doing the tot'n yourself.
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They don't say anything about pairs of people. What they say you CAN do is watch the person until the cops arrive. That is what Zimmerman says he was doing and Martin approached him. That is backed up by the transcript of the phone call with the girl. The first words spoken are "why are you following me" indicating Martin turned and confronted Zimmerman. He also said he knew someone was following and instead of running as his girl suggested or even continuing to walk normally he said he was "walking slower" which sounds like he was trying to close the gap.
I agree 100% that Zimmerman should have done everything possible to maintain at least 25 feet, just from a defense standpoint. The Tueller Drill demonstrates a guy with a knife 21 feet away will close the gap and stab a guy with a gun before you can shoot him. I would want 50-75 feet but his story is Martin was pursuing him as he ran to his truck..
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Han wrote:

Not "ALL". The instructions given to volunteers in New York are probably wildly different than those given to a collegue in other states. For example, in my state, the law is:
TEXAS PENAL CODE 9.42. DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY. A person is justified in using deadly force against another to protect land or tangible, movable property: (2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force is immediately necessary:              (A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or CRIMINAL MISCHIEF DURING THE NIGHTTIME... (emphasis added)
A cop, instructing neighborhood watch wardens, would be way off base telling citizens they should not carry a weapon or used deadly force when they clearly have the statutory right to do both
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national organization) there is a thing in the bylaws and their policies and procedures that they be unarmed. Some of this is so that they can have uniform policies across the states with differing law, but I am also sure a big part of that is to stay away from any kind of exposure to lawsuits.

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wrote:

I doubt 1% of the people who participate in neighborhood watch programs belong to that organization.
All it seems to be here is you say you have neighborhood watch, the cops give you another number to call, you get some pamphlets and you get some signs. (Zimmerman's call was not to 911, it was directly to the dispatcher). I have never heard anyone from the police tell me I can't keep an eye on the subject until the cops arrive. They tend to encourage it. They do say you should not confront the subject but it sounds like Martin confronted Zimmerman. The first words between them was "why are you following me".
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