OT: Shop Walmart (or HF) - Save the Planet

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The problem with having the Government involved in anything is that the government almost never considers what the unintended consequences are going to be, they just make knee jerk reactions to perceived problems and then wonder what the hell happened.
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wrote:

To put it another way, the government is never responsible for the results of their actions.
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Banning the distributors from trading energy futures was the coup de grace. Idiots!
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In some ways the people of California got screwed by their own government and Enron was simply the instrument of that screwing. Enron was NOT the only company that took advantage of the stupid laws in California to screw the residents. The residents were no less at fault for wanting cheap energy not matter the environmental consequences so long as it wasn't created in their own backyard.
Yes, most of the people screwed at Enron were the employees and other stockholders who lost everything. What I have found interesting is that Enron has become the poster child for corporate screwups only because it seemed to have some remote association with GWBush. At the same time Enron was going down the tubes another company that was even larger went down and nobody has ever used them as an example and that is WorldCom. We not have another example in GM but that too seems to go ignoreed. In all three cases the stock holders, bond holders, and other business suppliers that took the hit. I know because I lost most of my retirement fund on heavy investments in WorldCom. Such is life.
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wrote:

Other than electing stupid politicians, CA residents had nothing to do with it.

Boo Hoo. If they invested everything in one pot, they deserve what they got.

Not surprising at all. "It's George Bush's fault." ...no matter what "it" is.

...as it should be. The difference with GM is that the company was transferred from a higher class of ownership (bond holders) to one of a lower class (unions).

Dumb thing to do, eh? Were you an employee?
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Greedy business owners. Mostly Republicans.
*********************************************
Don't forget the bargain hunting consumer that wants cheap, cheap, cheap. . They want to make a lot of money, but don't want to pay a lot. Look for them lined up at Harbor Freight.
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Ed Pawlowski wrote:

There's seldom a line at Harbor Freight -- customer service, you know.
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I buy a lot of things at Harbor Freight because they are exactly what I need for the project that I am doing. Recent example was a $9.99 air chisel (made in China). I could have rented a top quality one for $15 or bought one for $79 but since I had only ONE project that I needed it for and would only be using it for one day it was the right product at the right price and it performed perfectly. If I were in the business that required the use of one every day then the $79 dollar tool might have been the better bargain but not for my use.
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You obviously haven't been to the HF in Montgomery.
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Congress, the oposite of progress.
--
Christopher A. Young
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Chinas daily manufacturing pay rate 3 bucks a day american:)
American manufacturing pay rate 29+ bucks per hour:(
If YOU owned a company where would the products come from? remember your competitors products are coming from low wage places...........
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There has to be a balance. Who is going to buy your products when unemployment keeps going up? You can get em as cheap as you want but if your customers have no money because they aren't working...
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You are absolutely right but just how many business owners can afford to remain in business when their competition has an advantage of labor costs that are 1/10 of what you must pay. I couldn't. I decided instead to close my business down after 25 years and move on rather than try to deal with the headaches of an offshore labor force. I just didn't have the desire or capital needed to compete in that arena.
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Sadly, the Democrats applaud your decision. They hate American business.
--
Christopher A. Young
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On Sep 16, 6:40pm, "Stormin Mormon"

That's gotta be the dumbest thing I've seen you post. I've always considered you a pretty smart feller but... wow, that's a whopper.

legroups.com...
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On Sep 16, 6:40pm, "Stormin Mormon"

I can't say that they hate American business but instead hate that business, especially big business, is a threat to their power base. This is not limited to American business but applies to all business with multinational corporations being at the top of their list. Their never ending demand for continuing to increase the taxes on the "rich" stems from the need to beat them down and control them. It is no accident that they foster the class warfare and encourage the ongoing conflict between business management and labor.

legroups.com...
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On 9/16/2010 10:41 PM, BobR wrote:

That is one of the most blindly opinionated statements I have ever read.

The rich are doing well enough.
The fact is the rich were doing better (and so were all Americans) during the marginal tax rates of Clinton. Or even the end of Reagan.
The tax cuts were unpaid for, as were two wars.
During W there was a lot of money sloshing around in the pockets of the rich. Little of that money was reinvested in business growth. It went into all these exotic investments, and running up the real estate market, all the things that are costing the nation so much now. Why wasn't the economy booming with all that money waiting to trickle down?
Obama did nothing less than save capitalism in this country. People who say Obama is a socialist or a communist know nothing about either one and just believe whatever sound bite they like. A lot of this explains the popularity of Sarah Palin, who knows little, can't complete a job, has a dysfunctional family, and is in it for her own good.
But the Tea Partiers like how she "thinks" because it plays into their emotions.
You may not like government, but breaking it, as the Tea Party wants, will have the same disastrous consequences as always. History is full of depressions and recessions from the Private Sector having run amuck.
As a parting shot to those Republicans worried about the deficit. Where was the concern when W turned a budget surplus, into a more than doubling of the National debt? All of that in relatively good times. And as far as employment, how about during W's first term there was almost a net loss of jobs. For the 8 years he was in office, only enough jobs were added that normally would have been needed for one year, not eight.
But none of this is the Republicans fault, it is always someone elses.
Go sell crazy somewhere else. I think Stormin Mormon has been staring into the bottom of a tea cup too long.
Jeff
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problem is that the spending continued. To say the cuts were unpaid for is to suggest that the government has dibs on a certain amount of our money no matter what. The Congress that passed the cuts knew how much they "cost" but did not stop spending.

Which alternative universe you in? Bush inherited Clinton's dot com bubble, his not doing anything to prevent 9-11 (both patently absurb statements, but since you are having presidents "own" things they have little control over I'll continue the trend). He got the Dow back to pre-bubble areas and tax receipts year over year grew all but the last year of his administration.


related to governmental action.

The budget surplus had already peaked and was gone by the time the first Bush budget came into effect, largely because government was did not "prevent" the dot com bubble.

business cycles that government has no control over.

--
I want to find a voracious, small-minded predator
and name it after the IRS.
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THE ONLY REASON THERE WAS EVER A BUDGET SURPLUS IS BECAUSE THE GOVERNMENT TRANSFERRED THE SOCIAL SECURITY AND MEDICARE FUNDS INTO THE GENERAL FUND. THAT WAS FORBIDDEN BY THE ORIGINAL LAW ESTABLISHING THOSE FUNDS.

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On 9/17/2010 9:33 AM, Kurt Ullman wrote:

Did you miss his thorough debunking of that myth on the Wallace/Clinton interview:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,215397,00.html
Or just read any of the books by W's inner circle on this.
He got the Dow back to

Oh poor poor W. The Dot Com Bust was small potatos as it affected only a small percentage of the economy. Stuff like that is easy to get over. Having dysfunction monetary is very hard.
BTW, the DOW was little affected by the bust:
http://stockcharts.com/charts/historical /
Look at how poorly everything did under W and how well under Clinton, even with the fall in NASDAQ.

How do you figure that?
Jeff

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