Also they are fire resistant, not fireproof. During my time doing fire investigations (albeit in the late 70s/early 80s) there were a few times where we opened up a rather pristine looking safe to find ash because the fire was hot enough and long enough to heat the inside of the safe too much.
The banks monitor the death notices every day and are required by law to secure the box (no entry) on the death of either boxholder.
The box may not be opened except in the presence of the tax auditor. At that time a list of the contents must be made for tax purposes.
That is the law here and I would guess, all states.
Colbyt
It's also a good place to keep data backup media, if one is smart enough not to believe the Ultimate Stupid Computer Concept: "I don't really keep anything important on my computer." That's until the thing breaks and then it's "OMG all my family photos were on that thing."
Your attorney should have a copy of your will, unless you were too cheap to pay an attorney a couple hundred bucks to draw up your will.
On 3/2/2011 7:45 AM, Colbyt wrote: ...
It certainly isn't _exactly_ the law in all states, no. As noted elsewhere, the law is different in different states and at least those w/ which I'm familiar depend on the status of the lessee(s) of the box as well as potential other circumstances.
One size does _NOT_ fit all, iow...
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Well...how secure is home and how valuable are the stored material? I had a safety deposit box for several years, until the cost went to about $100/year. I had documents that represented criminal acts by certain others who were violent family members and my only proof of certain events. It occurred to me that folks feel a lot safer by storing deeds and other irreplaceable items in SDB's that were not as safe as one would believe...living in coastal area of Florida, I asked at the bank if there was a h'cane and flood, would the boxes be water-tight. They said no. So adding ziplock bags or other suitable waterproof container would be needed. If my homeowners policy and photos of all belongings are in the SDB and a h'cane hits, all is lost? Some folks add a second "owner" in case of their demise...I helped a family friend with Alzheimer's gather all of her financial records when her condition became too severe for her to live alone. She was highly intelligent and adapted to Alzheimer's in remarkable ways...she always kept the day's newspaper on the dining room table so that she would know the date. Missing for a long time were about $40K in savings bonds and her family feared that she had given away large sums of money...we checked two or three banks over several days and one evening she had a sudden flash of memory...she went to her closet, grabbed a shoe box out of a pile of "stuff"...voila, there were her bonds.
One should let their family know of the SDB and what (appropriately) they need to know of it's contents. It makes one analize how trustworthy their family members are :o)
After retiring to Florida, my mom would give each of us kids the "death tour" whenever we visited...always kept her papers and valuables in order and gave each of us a copy of her will as well. My brother was added as owner of her relatively small savings account. When she passed away, the attorney for her estate charged, I think, $6K. When her estate was settled, there was about $1,300 left to pay him. I asked him whether, since her affairs were in good order and required little attorney time, would he forgive the remainder of his tab. He did so.
Yeah Joe- that way he can charge your heirs a percentage to probate it when you cease to be.
Mine said she'll hand it over to whoever I specify and they can take it anywhere they want to finish things off when I'm gone.
What's the alternative? Your family finds your will, wherever you keep it, and they duke it out over the details? Have you ever been involved in a scenario like that? It's really ugly sometimes. If often doesn't matter what the will says. Families will STILL find ways to turn it into a cluster fucque.
And, since OP said was in NY I did a _very_ little looking.
Looks like they're quite restrictive in comparison to the rules in place where I'm used to (not terribly surprising and yet another reason to be glad not in the NE).
But, there seems to have been a law change in 2000 that mitigates the unconditional locking and a proviso by which one can get access via waivers obtained from the State. I didn't find in the small amount of time I was willing to spend on the subject a full exposition but a NY State tax guidance document outlined a number of exceptions in some cases. But, afaict, that guidance didn't fully deal w/ case(s) of multiple lessees, trusts with named succession of trustee, estates w/ named executors/wills, etc., etc., etc., ...
From what I saw I'd say NY law is complex enough as to make any guesstulating from ahr worth even less than the outlay for the opinions posted... :)
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Do you keep your key around your neck?
These days there are really not that many irreplaceable documents. Your driver's license may be as hard to replace as the deed for your house, particularly in a "real ID" state. My broker has my stock certificates and usually I never actually see one.. If I had 10 pounds of gold, that might be something to put in the box but if you really think that is for the apocalypse, wouldn't you want it buried in the yard?
If your house burns down and you don't take your wallet, you will find out who your friends are. That is the bottom line.
I think my mother did the best on this of anyone I know. She had a list of everything of importance, who was supposed to get what, both kids had a copy and I was on all of her accounts. The state was never involved in anything. After her demise, I wrote the appropriate checks to disperse the assets and everyone was happy. I kept one joint account open for several years in case something turned up (checks etc) and when the dust completely settled, I closed that one. The only mistake that was made was later I turned up a $50 E bond in her name and I suppose that will end being her gift to the US government because there is no simple way to cash it. I doubt she even remembered she had it.
Your bank gave you false information. Boxes have two keys, one which they put in, one which you put in, then their representative leaves the room. It takes two keys to open them, or at least every one I've seen, and that would be about 100.
Safe deposit boxes are safe, although some have been burglarized, and accessed by bank employees in the past. A black plug key is put into the decedent's keyhole upon notification of death, and access may be restricted after that, but if someone gets there first and cleans it out ................. Some of the prementioned bank employee accesses were on deceased renters.
There are new things that are like safe deposit boxes that are used by all manner of people. Mostly drug and illicit money people, and those who just need access to lots of cash 24/7. Some have iris scans, and all are relatively safe.
You cannot get into a bank box 24/7, only during business hours and hot on bank holidays. They are not going to give you a receipt for a $4.6 million diamond ring, which they then legally take custody of, by filling out any paltry paperwork. It would have to be appraised, etc. Same for valuable coins, artifacts, historical items, one of a kind rarities, etc.
All in all, they are a very safe, secure place, although can be seized by the IRS or other means. If 24/7 access is an issue, then the private vaults would be your way to go. Just remember that you have to drive to and from there, and anyone on the street that sees you go in there at 2 AM might have an interest in you on the way in or out. The pros will know when you're holding, and the punks will shoot you even if they miss the call and don't get any money anyway.
Good luck.
If it wouldn't be divulging too much, what, exactly is it you want to secure? Be vague. Maybe the installation of a floor safe would do the same thing.
SteveB
Heart surgery pending? Read up and prepare. Download the book $10
What he said. I know I'll hit it one day, I just hope I won't be so old I'm strapped to a chair with terrycloth bath robe belts, throwing my Pablum on the wall.
If a guy just stuck it in a "vault", and could keep his mouth shut, he could outlive the money. A lot of people think of investing, but I think it would be enough to outlive myself, unless, of course I got stupid, which I don't think is going to happen.
Living off the grid and "disappearing" is something I have a little experience at. It doesn't require a Mensa mentality. First thing to do is get a disposable cell phone.
I'd take a used truck over a new one, and I'd be paranoid driving a Ferrari around a bunch of uninsured Mexicans. I shop at the factory outlets, and found that a $300 shirt is as scratchy as a $15 one, and lasts about the same.
I've had good stuff in my life. I could budget out of the wall safe and not feel bad about not making any interest. Do what I want when I want, get up when I want.
As for my heirs .......... they could have the rest. I worked for mine, they may get a leg up from what's left over, or just do what I did.
SteveB
Heart surgery pending? Read up and prepare. Download the book $10
Next time you're in the vault, look for black dime sized plugs in some of the keys. They're there for a reason. No one is going in there without an audience being present. There are ways to freeze them.
SteveB
Heart surgery pending? Read up and prepare. Download the book $10
An Obit does not remove the legal entitlement made earlier for the second person to "access the box at any time". It's set up as an either/or where one can enter, or both are required, just like bank check signature cards. If there were a restriction that TWO people could only share one key and one box, then there's a requirement that the TWO renters be present, be alive, and match the signatures. There is a stipulation that can be enacted before the issuance of the keys as to whether or not one or both parties MUST be present. In case of a dual access signature requirement, the bank would not legally let the ONE person into the box without the OTHER being present and signing, and the box would be sealed pending legal action. The attempted entrance would be legally and officially noted in the bank record. If the bank allowed the ONE person into the box without the presence and signature of the other IF PREVIOUSLY STIPULATED, they would have the liability.
But you knew that, right?
SteveB
Heart surgery pending? Read up and prepare. Download the book $10
And I talked out of my ass in my earlier post, not stating that what I was saying was only the status in the states I had lived in.
Like everything, it is good to ask these questions first.
"dpb" wrote
I know. Let's ask Rush. He learned enough about NY law to move out.
SteveB ;-)
Heart surgery pending? Read up and prepare. Download the book $10
"Puddin' Man" wrote
Or unless one of the heirs beats feet to a lawyer and puts a freeze on everything.
Which has been known to happen.
Steve
The Treasury Department will not
Depends. Total destruction, nothing, partial destruction, partial compensation.
Steve
wrote
One of my wives was a paralegal for a family law lawyer. Very old large estates in Louisiana. In the five years she worked for him, we got to see many family scenarios play out. When they say, "It's not about the money, it's about the principle," it's about the money. Heirs, relatives, family members, loved ones, friends, all seem to change when enough zeros come into play. Fistfights in the waiting room. Scheduling so antagonistic groups wouldn't show up within 4 hours of each other.
BTW, we were also privy to the longest murder trial in Louisiana history, which was very interesting.
Steve
I worked in a bank and I read the obits every day, hoping to see my boss's name there.
If you have important info on your computer, backing it up onto CD or DVD and storing the disks off-site in a safety deposit box is a good idea in case of fire, flood, tornado, burglary, etc. Or you could just leave the disks at your office, in your gym locker, at a friend's house...
If the banks do read the obits, how do they know it's their customer? Don't people named John Smith die every day?
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