My niece needs some auto parts. I called Advanced Auto Parts. They
need the money before they can order the parts from the factory
(Ford). Cool........I have a 15k limit on my card. Ready for my card
number? Well we have to have you come down here and bring the card to
Well.......this is a part that comes from the dealer. We have to get
you to come in to pay for it.
I can only guess they suspect foul play. Anyone else get turned down
for trying to order over the phone?
Ask any one of your friends who might run a business where the public
purchases things from them that accepts a credit card as payment...
Transactions which are non-swiped cost the business double what
swiped transactions cost... 2% of the transaction total vs 4%...
Apparently the Auto Parts store didn't want to pay 4% of the total
sale on a special order...
With retail business being sluggish, every penny adds up...
This is why some businesses still take imprints of the credit cards,
it proves the card was present at the time of sale...
In the past ten years the only businesses I have had take credit card
imprints have been hotels. I use a secure or virtual account number to
guarantee the reservation, but they have never honored it at the desk
unless the reservation included prepayment.
Sounds to me like you haven't dealt with a small enough business,
the big chain stores use electronic capture of signature of the
person using the card as well as store CCTV footage to document
who made the purchase rather than keeping a printed copy of
the receipt on file in the store for the required retention period...
Smaller stores still imprint the card, especially when the card
doesn't swipe and the numbers had to be punched in manually,
as the card is either swiped or imprinted to prove it was there
at the time of purchase... Smaller stores also still deal with
keeping extra copies of the receipts on file in case of a
charge back during the retention period...
LOL... Using a "secure" or "virtual" account number to do
anything where you have to reserve something is stupid,
as the virtual account number won't match your name
and address like the info on your actual real account will,
hotels tend to like knowing the real name of the person
reserving the room in case of a no show as they have
the information to send the bill -- this is why your attempts
at anonymous reservations with a credit card that didn't
match the name you reserved under were not honored
without payment of a deposit...
Here in Canada we've had a small chip on our credit cards for about 2
years now. About 75% of the retailers I go to (big box, grocery stores,
restaurants, etc) have chip-enabled readers where you slide in the card
and enter a 4-digit pin to complete the transaction. This replaces the
requirement to sign anything, and the cashier doesn't ask to see the
card (let alone take an imprint of it).
I believe that if 3 incorrect attempts are made to enter the PIN within
a short span of time that the card is automatically disabled.
At gas pumps here in Canada, when you slide in your credit card to pay
at the pump, we don't have to enter our zip-code (or postal code in our
case) to complete the transaction, which is something you have to do at
many pumps in the US (or at least in california).
At some pumps here, I don't even have to slide my card into a reader -
just wave it near a small panel on the pump marked with a "wavy" logo
that indicates some sort of RF transciever (this is NOT speed-pass).
I understand that Europe also has CC's with chip-and-pin.
But the US is being backwards about this by not introducing credit cards
with "chip-and-pin" technology. You should ask your banks and credit
card companies why they prefer to soak you with high fees and interest
rates as a way to pay for CC fraud rather than impliment technology to
I've never heard of the use of a secure or virtual account number. How
does that work? I assume by virtual account number you mean a
credit-card number that is different than the one embossed on your real
Careful - your northern superiority complex is showing. Chip & Pin got a
foothold in Europe because of the poor and expensive phone systems that were in
place at the time. Credit card companies needed a secure and sure way of
validating a translation without having to make an expensive phone call.
Meanwhile, in the US ubiquitous and inexpensive local phone calls made it
possible to roll out cash registers, vending machines, gas pumps and cheap
validation terminals all across the country. The sheer number of terminals in
the US is several orders of magnitude larger than in Canada. The cost of
replacing all those terminals would ultimately be passed on to the consumer - an
expense the US isn't in a particular hurry to take on.
That said, Visa has announced plans to support Chip & Pin in the US for those
banks that want to issue those cards. They'll be available in a year or so.
I liked the chip and pin in Europe. As I did the wireless portable
terminals they have, so my credit card never left my sight. IIRC, they
had them in a local Legal Sea Foods restaurant (Garden State Mall,
Paramus, NJ) now also.
At a restaurant in Canada a few years back they entered our order into a
wireless terminal, then did the cc processing the same way.
I've also seen the wireless cc terminals used by itinerant vendors at
flea markets and the like.
I'll say. Europe and SE Asia started using card chip and PIN almost 10
years ago. Small business still does not want to use POS machine which
handles chip and PIN processing. This machine costs more that old swipe
and sign one. Lazy Canucks are known to use most debit and CC in the
world at an extra cost(service charge). We seniors get break on that
part on our bank account.
Careful - your southern ignorance is showing.
Go and read this:
And then tell me where your crack-pot European "poor and expensive phone
system" theory factors into this story.
We do have credit cards with RFID chips if you ask for them, you just wave
it close to the merchant's terminal, however, the chipped cards being
discussed have a gold contact patch on the face that must contact with the
merchant's terminal by inserting the card into a slot. Nearly all credit
cards are being changed over to this type with an auxiliary magnetic stripe
on the back. This is not a RF type of chip.
I did - and didn't see anything that contradicted what I posted. This statement
in particular was interesting:
"For American card issuers, the cost of implementing the new system may be
prohibitive, says Coleman."
I explained the origins of chip & pin and why it isn't generally available in
the US today. What exactly do you disagree with?.
I believe that some things like balance remaining/available get written
to the chip, so less info has to be transmitted over the data lines. The
whole chip thing was said (somewhere) to be much more secure and theft
On Wed, 09 Nov 2011 20:41:13 -0500, firstname.lastname@example.org wrote:
Nothing, other than all CC terminals would need PIN entry capability. This
could be a problem with restaurants, for example.
The chip allows off-line use, important for the early European market (20
years ago). As noted above, not so much in the US. The two systems started
apart, for good reason, and the cost to change either exceeds any benefit.
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