OT: MH370 more nutty stuff

Now we have a former Malaysian Prime Minister accusing the CIA and Boeing of having taken over the plane by remote control and flying off to somewhere. Is everyone associated with the Malaysian govt nuts and/or incompetent?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2632447/CIA-knows-missing-Flight-MH370-says-former-Malaysian-PM-Dr-Mahathir.html
"Missing Flight MH370 did not crash and its current whereabouts may be know to the Central Intelligence Agency and the Boeing aircraft company, Malaysia's influential former prime minister Mahathir Mohamad has claimed. Dr Mahathir said the plane could have been switched onto autopilot remotely by the CIA if it had been hijacked."
(There is of course no shred of evidence that this CIA controlled system exists in any plane.)
'Airplanes don't just disappear,' he said. 'Certainly not these days with all the powerful communication systems, radio and satellite tracking and filmless cameras which operate almost indefinitely and possess huge storage capacities.'
(Sure, but the radio and satellite tracking systems, ie VHF radios, transponders, ACARS were off, which a pilot or hijacker with some minimal knowledge about the plane could easily do.)
'The plane is somewhere, maybe without MAS [Malaysia Airlines] markings,' he said, reports the Sydney Morning Herald.
(The CIA hijacked it, flew it to where? repainted it? for what purpose? where are the passengers?)
'It is a waste of time and money to look for debris or oil slick or to listen for pings from the black box.
"For some reason, the media will not print anything that involves Boeing or the CIA,' he said.
(I guess that's what happens when you're a conspiracy nut with nothing to support your accusations.)
Dr Mahathir, 88, who was Malaysia's prime minister between 1981 and 2003, said the missing flight's communication system 'must have been disabled'.
'Or else the flight of MH370 would have been tracked by satellites which normally provide data on all commercial flights, inclusive of data on location, kind of aircraft, flight number, departure airport and destination.
(Wow! He figured that out? We knew on day 1 that there was no communication via VHF radio, and that the transponders and ACARS had been disabled.)
'But the data seems unavailable. The plane just disappeared seemingly from all screens.
(Wow, that's new! Actually, it didn't disappear from all screens. Malaysian militart and civilan radar continued to track it for portions of the next hour as it flew back across Malaysia)
'All the communications and GPS equipment must have been installed by Boeing. If they failed or have been disabled Boeing must know how it can be done.
(Sure they know how it can be done, ss do all the many pilots who've been telling us since the first days. The pilot or a hijacker could do it by opening a couple of cockpit breakers.)
'Surely Boeing would ensure that they cannot be easily disabled as they are vital to the safety and operation of the plane.'
(Sure speculate on what Boeing might have done, instead of how the systems actually work, which has been gone over extensively in the media, citing loads of credible sources, eg pilots, 777 trainin pilots, accident investigators, showing it done in simulators, etc.)
"Dr Mahathir's blog posts come after the current Malaysian Prime Minister Najib Razak described the location by satellite of purported MH370 debris in the Indian Ocean as 'bizarre' and 'hard to believe'. Mr Najib told CNN he did not believe it when he first heard about the critical satellite data on which the current search in the Indian Ocean is based on. 'To be honest, I found it hard to believe,' said the Prime Minister. 'It's a bizarre scenario which none of us could have contemplated so that's why when I met the team...of foremost experts in aviation industry I asked them again and again "are you sure?"'
'And their answer to me was we are as sure as we can possibly be.'
(I too was wondering how exactly Inmarsat was doing this. And I agree with the families who want the raw Inmarsat data released so their analysis can be vetted by other experts. The Malaysian govt, which the above PM heads, has resisted that for weeks, but apparently has finally OK'd it. But you'd have to be a real dope of a PM to spew out the above statement, bascially undermining your own govt investigation's credibility. And even worse, to spew it out while refusing for weeks to release the raw Inmarsat. But they seem to be able to consistently make themselves look like buffoons since day one.)
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On Tue, 20 May 2014 05:57:41 -0700 (PDT), trader_4

well, duh!!! They hide the controller under the pilot's seat.
I think this happens a lot. The CIA controls the Bermuda Triangle where they took this plane.
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wrote:

If there was, they wouldn't be doing their job very well. Until the recent revelations no one knew how deeply embedded the CIA and NSA were in the world's telecommunications. (-: My paranoid friend assures me the Feds have built back doors into OnStar and all its look-alike systems. My favorite is still the Montana rancher on 60 minutes who took out a $100 bill, pointed to the little ID filament embedded in the paper and said "this is how they are tracking the location of ever $100 bill from space." And he had been making perfect sense about the Federal control of vast tracts of western (but not eastern) lands.

The CIA used a drone that was trailing big streamers of foil and emitting false ACARS signals that took up the course of the plane as it was diverted to a nearby airstrip. Then the drone flew on, looking much bigger than it was to radar and following standard flight paths to lead the searchers on a wild goose chase - at least according to one blog I read. The sad part is that if you ask the Malaysian in the street now, they probably *will* blame the CIA because this 88 year old former prime minister guy said so.
WWIII is starting up in that area of the world, we just don't know it yet:
http://deathbychina.com/
I got the DVD from Netflix and normally I don't watch overt propaganda films but this one has been really quite fascinating and doesn't take a conservative or liberal viewpoint, using talking heads from both sides of the aisle. Lots of scary stuff about how we've already lost much of the first big economic battle and about the damage China's unfair trade practices have done to our industrial base.
The reviews all pretty much said "overhyped to the extreme but basically the truth" and a scary truth it is.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_by_China
--
Bobby G.


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so one or two highjackers hide in the equiptement bay, get out and take over the cockpit....
they cut all communications by tripping the appropiate breakers
they enter or use a course already entered into the auto pilot, which takes the airliner to very high altitudes with the emergency oxygen system shut off....
everyone onboard except the highjackers die.
the aircraft flys to wherever the highjackers want.
the flew out over the indian ocean and must of crashed was a cover story, to prevent a world panic. the malaysian airliner has been modified as a flying bomb and waiting for terrorists to pick its target.
this is why the raw data hasnt been released.
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On Wednesday, May 21, 2014 2:17:50 PM UTC-4, bob haller wrote:

Assuming the above was accomplished, there are still some very big problems. One is that these hijackers would have to be able to land the airplane. Someone will probably say, "the plane can land itself". Which is true, if they set it into that mode, *and* the airport is equipped with the appropriate ILS system, meaning you can't land it just anywhere, but it has to be some major airport. How you do that without it being noticed, IDK.
And if they hand flew the landing, even that has major problems. You need a substantial runway, that is not only long enough but strong enough to handle a 777. That isn't your typical small airport, nor is it a random road in the desert, etc. Certainly not if you intend to be able to use the airplane again. It's going to be hard to use a 777 with ripped off landing gear. Also, how you land it so on one sees it, etc would seem to be really big problems. Also, no countries in the likely land paths for such a feat reported ever tracking it on radar.

The Malaysian officials have announced a couple days ago that they have given Inmarsat permission to do that, so it's coming. I agree it should have been done weeks ago, but it's hardly the basis for grand conspiracies. Why would Inmarsat in the UK get involved in a conspiracy to coverup what happened? Given all the countries and agencies that are involved and how dumb Malaysia has been in handling this in general, I don't see how you could create this grand conspiracy. And what logic is there to covering it up, instead of finding the plane? If it had been flown somewhere and repurposed as you say, then it winds up flying into a target, how is that going to work to the benefit of all those covering it up?
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On Wed, 21 May 2014 11:52:13 -0700 (PDT), trader_4

I agree, if this plane is not in the water, it is wadded up on the side of a mountain somewhere The problem with that is, someone would have seen it by now. We may not have many assets looking at the Southern Indian Ocean but we have plenty is South Asia.

I am conflicted on this. If they just throw all of this on the net to allow crowd sourcing, there may be someone who finds something that they missed but there will be far more people seeing things that are not there and further stirring up wild conspiracy theories.
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On Wednesday, May 21, 2014 3:34:46 PM UTC-4, snipped-for-privacy@aol.com wrote:

Yes, that's a good point. But I don't think they have a choice at this point. The credibility of the Malaysians is close to zero and if they don't let it out, then I think it looks even worse. Maybe a good idea would be to find a bunch of credible experts, eg from academia, that are willing to review it, put a list together and try to find agreement between the govt, China, the families, etc as to an acceptable bunch from that list to have review it. Then maybe release it to that team first, then after they review it, later to the public. How easy it would be for the typical internet folks to do the correct analysis, IDK. But I agree, it's likely some wing nuts are going to try to twist and turn it.
An example of what you're talking about is when they put out the full cockpit communications with ATC. MH370 talked to ground control at the airport, airport tower, the KL ATC, maybe another ATC, etc. All of that also had communication with various other planes. So, what they apparently did was just edit it to put together the part related to MH370. But if you listen to it, you can hear papers shuffling, etc, probably because they were just doing the editing half-assed, but doing that lead to accusations that it was "edited". Well, of course it was. They cut out all the parts that are not communications with 370 and then put the 4 or whatever separate communications together into one, so you can listen to it start to finish, listening for 8 mins or whatever instead of an hour and a half. What they should have done is also release the originals so that anyone that wants to compare them, can see that the editing was just done for convenience, not to alter what's there. That of course assumes they really didn't edit out anything of MH370, but who knows.
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news:02cf3620-03d1-459d-9a91-

grand

It's probably taken them that long to phony up some data. The one thing that the Birthers were right about is that the more time it takes to present evidence, the more likely it is to be suspect.

happened?
Because someone from MI-6 came by and said the magic words: "This is a matter of national security." We've seen what American companies will do when they're faced with national security claims.

This has been handled most oddly since the very beginning. It has all the earmarks of some kind of coverup. The Malaysians were reversing themselves on nearly a daily basis in the beginning and didn't even get the words of the last tranmission from the plane correctly.
Something's very wrong with this picture and has been since day one. Maybe we'll find out someday and maybe never. The search area is so immense that plane may never be found and if it is, forensic analysis may not reveal much because of the deterioration of the wreckage and victim's bodies.
--
Bobby G.



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On Wednesday, May 21, 2014 7:10:28 PM UTC-4, Robert Green wrote:

Then the next logical questions would be why would MI-6 get involved in covering this up? Did the UK shoot it down? And why falsify sat data at all? Without it, the last known track took the plane out into the Indian Ocean anyway. Without the sat data, the plane could be *anywhere* in the entire Indian Ocean. It makes sense to you to come up with a plan to falsify sat data to pinpoint a location to look, knowing that the plane isn't there? Instead of just leaving it as it would have been, ie the plane was last seen heading into the Indian Ocean?
By now the conspiracy would have to include such a long list of players, that it's beyond belief. MI-6, CIA, FBI, NTSB, Malaysian govt, China, etc. And not one person that knows it's being falsified has made an anonymous call to CNN? What's the likelihood of that compared to the Malaysians just being incompetent? And if it was a coverup run by MI-6, you would think they could have done a far better job, with far less obvious bungling, that has destroyed the Malaysian's credibility.

Sure, I agree it's been handled poorly. The biggest part of that was Malaysian officials refusing to allow in outside expert help. It's not the first time that's happened. It just happened again in Nigeria, with the govt there taking a long time to allow other countries to help with the search for the missing 200 girls. But incompetence doesn't equal conspiracy. You've seen that Malaysian Civil Aviation official saying all kinds of dumb things. You've seen the PM shut the door, declaring after a couple weeks that the plane went down near Australia, there is no hope of survivors and people need to accept that. Then a few days later, the CA official who works for the PM, opens the door again for the possibility of survivors.
All that fits in nicely with them all being incompetent, not so much with a grand MI-6 level conspiracy.

If there's wreckage found, it will certainly show if there was a fire on board or not. And simple things, like the position of the actuators can tell if it was still flying straight and level, ran out of gas, or if it was plunged deliberately into the sea.
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