OT: Hybrid cars make no economical sense

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Further remind them that Congress has specifically included language in the NRC authorizing statute that says that NRC actions preempt any state or local regulation.
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Kurt Ullman wrote:

Good idea!
I forgot to suggest that you should also send a registered letter to Mr. Crank, in the name of the HOA (it shouldn't be too hard to dummy up some stationary), that his request to use an additional trashcan on collection day has been denied. Furthermore, the association has fielded several complaints about the car sometimes parked in his driveway: it needs washing.
That way, when one contacts the other, they'll be yelling about two separate issues which will generate more confusion.
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:-)
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Andrew
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Andrew Schulman wrote:

    A friend who wears a pacemaker will be pleased to hear about this!
Steve
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I dont' think that most people realize that NUCLEAR power plants STILL boil water and spin a generator with steam. So what you'd be asking for is a steam powered car i rekon. Then you got to have a big water tank and a generator etc etc. You might be able to apply this technology to a semi truck sized vehicle. maybe.
s

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On Dec 11, 8:40pm, "Steve Barker DLT"

http://www.stanleysteamers.com /
Andrew
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Steve Barker DLT wrote:

Such devices are called EXTERNAL combustion engines. And while an old steam locomotive is indeed huge, small steam engines can develop plenty of power. They take about a minute to get going, however.
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Wrong again Tashi. Just as you were a few weeks ago when you claimed to have introduced me to the concept of using Spanish cedar for necks. There are guitars in existence which I built using cedro handles in the early 70s.
Our discussion of that material was in connection with it's use as brace stock on backs. As usual you managed to get all over heated when I pointed out that brace failures with cedro were far more common than they were when spruce brace stock was used.
In your interpretation that degenerated into me not having been aware of the material at all until you shone the brilliant beacon of your experience and wisdom on my particular corner of the bush.
If your other 'scholarly' revelations are of the same calibre, you're not adding much to this or any other discussion. KH

Yea! that's Caribou Kevin, he usually doesn't know what he's talking about.
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Kevin Hall wrote:

Batter technology keeps improving and car batteries fail more in hot climate than cold.
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Kevin Hall wrote:

I think you ought to convert your beloved 'Suby' to run on bear grease
LA

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wrote:

Less pollution driving the vehicle, but manufacturing the electric motor and battery system of the car creates HUGE amounts of pollution. The spent batteries need to be disposed of.
At least we can clean the air of the exhaust fumes by planting more greenery.
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On Thu, 11 Dec 2008 07:29:30 -0800 (PST), snipped-for-privacy@rochester.rr.com wrote:

Batteries are VERY recyclable. The amount of pollution from manufacturing a hybrid is essentially no diofferent than for any other vehicle. In fact, they tend to be among the smallest and lightest vehicles made, so if anything, they cause less pollution during manufacture.
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From what I can see of this thread is the biggest critics of hybrid vehicles are people that don't own them and have no real data or information.
I own a 2006 Prius. I have for about 3 years. They are great cars with great warranties that need little maintenance. Get fantastic gas mileage and cost about the same as a Camry.
Green house gasses aside; theses are nice cars. Talk to anyone who owns one. I've yet to see anyone who doesn't love their Prius. It is truly a Toyota success story. Some people just hate it when someone gets it right.
Olddog
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The upcharge on the Camry hybrid vs the 4cyl is around $6000. To recoup that cost in gas savings could take upwards of 4 years depending on driving habits. So for those who only keep their cars for 3 years then trade-in, hybrids are a bust. But for those who both keep their cars over 5 years AND drive a lot of stop and go miles they might get their $6000 back.
If a full-coverage battery warranty and showroom floor price parity happen then the numbers add up as I said in my original post. But without either high city miles or many years of ownership the $6000 is difficult to recoup.
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The upcharge on the Camry hybrid vs the 4cyl is around $6000. To recoup that cost in gas savings could take upwards of 4 years depending on driving habits. So for those who only keep their cars for 3 years then trade-in, hybrids are a bust. But for those who both keep their cars over 5 years AND drive a lot of stop and go miles they might get their $6000 back.
If a full-coverage battery warranty and showroom floor price parity happen then the numbers add up as I said in my original post. But without either high city miles or many years of ownership the $6000 is difficult to recoup.
========================================= That's comparing the Camry. I own a Prius and for 22k you get a very nice car and very good mileage..
BTW: I get much better hwy mileage than Toyota advertises. We avg around 60 mpg on the hwy. So far I don't think were getting the 48 in the city but I could be wrong. More like 45 (when I'm driving). About 30 when my wife drives.
So I don't agree with the "stop and go" argument.
Olddog
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On Thu, 11 Dec 2008 13:11:03 -0800, RickH wrote:

You're thinking about this the wrong way. You don't need to recoup the 6000 if what you WANT is a hybrid. Many people pay several hundred extra for leather (never recouped). A nav-system can add 2 or 3 grand (never recouped). The upcharge to buy a Mercedes versus a Kia can be 50 or 60 grand. Does the Mercedes buyer expect to recoup that difference? Of course not.
People buy hybrids because that is the vehicle they wish to drive. They (for the most part) couldn't care less about when (if ever) they will break even on the extra cost.
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On Thu, 11 Dec 2008 22:14:17 GMT, Rick Brandt

Treating someone for cancer probably doen't make economical sense in many, if not most cases. Same for organ transplants. Medical research trying find ways to extend human lives is probably not economically smart at all.
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wrote:

For heart transplants, the break-even point appears to be 55 y/o or younger. At that point they can get back to work and make money for a long enough time to break even, at least according to some of the studies. Especially over the last 15 or so years as they get better. Cancer depends on the cancer. Those you have low cure rates on, like say pancreatic cancer, then it doesn't make much sense. Others, it can depending on the stage, etc.
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You are comparing apples to oranges. In marketing terms the "value proposition" being offered by hybrids is that they are economical, I say they are not economical until you recoup the upfront cost and possible battery. Whereas the "value proposition" for leather seats is greater comfort for ones ass. So the two cannot be compared. I'm saying the basic value proposition of hybrids is a lie when you consider the whole cost. And why would an "economy minded", (hybrid candidate), shopper not evaluate ALL the numbers? Since economy IS their main draw.
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