OT Hints on replacing computer CMOS battery?

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On 7/9/2015 5:52 PM, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

Dallas.
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wrote:

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On Thursday, July 9, 2015 at 8:24:16 PM UTC-4, bob_villa wrote:

I know what CMOS RAM is, it's 40 year old technology. That's why for a long time, the settings have been stored in Flash memory now, because it doesn't require battery backup. As I said, AFAIK, the only thing that requires a battery is the clock.
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On Friday, July 10, 2015 at 7:16:19 AM UTC-5, trader_4 wrote:

As per usual, you contradict yourself, "...for a long time"-"AFAIK"!
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bob_villa wrote:

I have a (dead now) Tosh laptop that had a dead CMOS battery . The only thing that was ever affected is the clock if I let it drain the (main) battery .
--
Snag



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wrote:

been lost, ut on Tosh laptops the factory installed ramand drive specs were urned into the bios as default, so there was very little to customize.
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On Friday, July 10, 2015 at 1:16:44 PM UTC-4, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

Some will never learn.... Once again, from AMI, a leading supplier of BIOSs to the PC industry:
http://www.ami.com/support/faqs/
"Note: Although the BIOS settings are stored in Flash memory, a battery is required to maintain the main board's RTC settings."
Completely consistent with what Mr. Coombs is reporting happens with his computer.
Or From Wikipedia:
"Nonvolatile BIOS memory refers to a small memory on PC motherboards that i s used to store BIOS settings. It was traditionally called CMOS RAM because it used a volatile, low-power complementary metal-oxide-semiconductor (CMO S) SRAM (such as the Motorola MC146818 or similar) powered by a small batte ry when system power was off (called the CMOS battery).
The term remains in wide use but it has grown into a misnomer: nonvolatile storage in contemporary computers is often in EEPROM or flash memory (like the BIOS code itself); the remaining usage for the battery is then to keep the real-time clock (RTC) going."
Just the facts Clare and note that I'm not calling on anyone to plonk, or censor you.
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On Friday, July 10, 2015 at 8:34:45 AM UTC-4, bob_villa wrote:

No, as usual, you're making things up. Nothing I said there is contradictory. Think about this, Flash has been available for over two decades, EEPROM even longer. They are non-volatile inexpensive and don't require a battery. Flash is even used for the Bios, so it would be very easy to use a tiny section of that to also store the setup data, it would essentially be free.
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On Friday, July 10, 2015 at 8:15:12 AM UTC-5, trader_4 wrote:

So now you're talking hypothetically, "...so it would be very easy...", but not factual! And you're saying flash, when in fact they use NVRAM...try not to guess at things!
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On Friday, July 10, 2015 at 9:40:49 AM UTC-4, bob_villa wrote:

Take a look at my post, where I quoted AMI which is an actual major supplier of BIOS and similar technology to the PC industry. They make the software that stores the BIOS data, they certainly know where it's stored. That's about as "factual" as you can get. Here, they directly address the issue:
"Note: Although the BIOS settings are stored in Flash memory, a battery is required to maintain the main board's RTC settings."
http://www.ami.com/support/faqs/
Note that is consistent with what Mr. Coombs just posted. He has a laptop with a dead CMOS battery and he says it works just fine, the only thing he loses is the date/time.
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On Friday, July 10, 2015 at 9:10:21 AM UTC-5, trader_4 wrote:

The 2nd time you referred to your cohort to back-up your blathering...his CMOS could have been marginal, holding settings but not RTC.
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On Friday, July 10, 2015 at 11:10:10 AM UTC-4, bob_villa wrote:

try not to guess at things!

You act like Mr. Coombs is all that I posted and keep avoiding the 12ft elephant in the room:
"Note: Although the BIOS settings are stored in Flash memory, a battery is required to maintain the main board's RTC settings."
That's from AMI, a major supplier of BIOS's to the PC industry. They supply the software that manages the BIOS settings. I guess they're my "cohort" too....
Or how about these:
http://www.pcbuyerbeware.co.uk/BIOS.htm
"Motherboard battery
Note that desktop and laptop PCs now store the EFI settings in non-volatile permanent memory that retains information when the PC is switched off, whi ch means that the EFI does not require to make use of a battery supplied by the PC's motherboard to retain its data. However, motherboards still have a battery because the Real Time Clock (RTC) that keeps date and time inform ation has to be powered. "
Nonvolatile BIOS memory
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
"Nonvolatile BIOS memory refers to a small memory on PC motherboards that i s used to store BIOS settings. It was traditionally called CMOS RAM because it used a volatile, low-power complementary metal-oxide-semiconductor (CMO S) SRAM (such as the Motorola MC146818 or similar) powered by a small batte ry when system power was off (called the CMOS battery).
The term remains in wide use but it has grown into a misnomer: nonvolatile storage in contemporary computers is often in EEPROM or flash memory (like the BIOS code itself); the remaining usage for the battery is then to keep the real-time clock (RTC) going."
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On Friday, July 10, 2015 at 10:38:29 AM UTC-5, trader_4 wrote: <snip>

e the BIOS code itself); the remaining usage for the battery is then to kee p the real-time clock (RTC) going."
The 12' elephant in the room is your ego...the point you are totally ignori ng is your use of the word flash instead of NVRAM...get with the "program"!
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On Friday, July 10, 2015 at 11:50:41 AM UTC-4, bob_villa wrote:

ike the BIOS code itself); the remaining usage for the battery is then to k eep the real-time clock (RTC) going."

"!
Apparently you can't read. AMI clearly says EEPROM or Flash is often used. Neither of those are NVRAM. I said Flash. You claimed it was stored only in CMOS RAM and required a battery or the setup would be lost. Clearly AMI says otherwise. Feel free to dig yourself deeper. You're in way over your head. head.
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On Fri, 10 Jul 2015 08:10:06 -0700 (PDT), bob_villa

his drivel second and third hand.
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On Friday, July 10, 2015 at 1:20:53 PM UTC-4, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

Why don't you go plonk yourself? As dumb as you are, with as many totally wrong posts, especially on electrical code issues, I still haven't "plonked" you and would never call for anyone else to do so. By ignoring people, you're just living in your own little world, which leads to, well, being dumb.
And note, instead of the ad hominem attack, why not just address the issuem where I was correct and what I posted to support it?
AMI:
"Note: Although the BIOS settings are stored in Flash memory, a battery is required to maintain the main board's RTC settings."
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On 7/10/2015 12:58 PM, trader_4 wrote:

Exactly, and even the RTC doesn't matter (to me anyway) since the OS retrieves the time and resets the RTC immediately after system boot.
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While this is not inaccurate, the CMOS is still used when booting legacy operating systems (e.g. win2k) on newer model desktop computers.
Note that this is also specific to intel/amd x86 systems. ARM64 servers will store all configuration information using SPI or eMMC non-volatile memory and don't have the Intel CMOS RTC.

The default values in his CMOS memory are presumably sufficient for operation. He may not be getting optimal performance from his system, however.
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On Friday, July 10, 2015 at 11:45:35 AM UTC-4, Scott Lurndal wrote:

I'm fine with all except the last part. After what you posted, isn't the alternative and more likely situation that Mr. Coombs PC has the BIOS setup actually stored in Flash or EEPROM and hence it doesn't lose them even though it has a dead battery?
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On Friday, July 10, 2015 at 10:56:42 AM UTC-5, trader_4 wrote:

Keep grasping as stars...that's what dreamers do.
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