OT: GOP Voter Fraud Accusations Suddenly Blowing Up In Their Faces

Page 2 of 5  


Signatures can be imitated.
At best, signature matching ensures that the person voting is probably the same person who registered to vote. It does not establish that the person is an eligible voter in the first place, and it cannot detect multiple registrations by the same individual under different names.

Like a signature, a fingerprint proves only that the person casting the vote is the same as the person who registered, not that he is eligible to do so.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

It's called forgery (a felony in most states) and not that hard to detect. In fact there are various software apps available that do a good job of detecting those as well as others that do a equally good job of IDing finger prints.
As to photo ID those can be had for cheap. Just check out the cases of ID theft. Last one nailed for ID theft in this area had something like 200 obstinately valid photo IDs in their possession.
As to how easy just ask any reasonably sharp underage teen.

One could say the same for photo ID but disregarding that ... If a person is registered the presumption, under the law, is that he/she was vetted at the time of registration and is eligible to vote. There are procedures in place to challenge the registration but the hard reality, historcially, is most such attempts come up tilt.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

If it were that easy to detect, nobody would ever get away with signing charge slips for a stolen credit card.
[...]

No, let's *not* disregard that, because it isn't true.
The documents necessary to procure a valid photo ID are also sufficient to prove eligibility to vote:
In order to renew my Indiana driver's license a few months ago, I had to furnish, in addition to my soon-to-expire license, all of... - W-2 statement (to prove my social security number) - recent utility bill and pay stub (to prove current Indiana residence) - certified copy of my birth certificate (to prove US citizenship)

True -- but that does nothing to ensure that the person casting the vote is the person who registered.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
"Doug Miller" <

Detection requires someone or something to check.
Some card companies don't even ask for a signature (try to sign with an on line purchase) as they KNOW that they can charge the fraud back to the merchant with a $25 penalty.
In DFW it seems that if there is any question on a voters signature the DA gets involved and someone (sometimes several someones) gets to explain it to the judge.
Texas in the recent federal case asserted there were 50 cases of voter fraud in the past ten years. In responce to a court order under discovery they could not substantiate even so much as one.

Only in your world. Educate me. How does a photo ID prove more than that the person is little more than registered and is otherwise eligible? Keep in mind that your sharper underage teen can get very convincing ID for under $100.

I've had DL in multiple states and have never been required to produce a certified copy of my BC. Nor has my wife.
We've done a Santa and Mrs. gig for years. I have, as does she, photo ID that is so convincing that when a state trooper looked at it the only way to tell without special equipment that it was not a valid ID is that the photo showed me by name and garb as Santa.
Then there are ample cases where those engaged in ID theft are often aprehened with multiple ID all different names but the same photo. Funny but all those aprehended at that game were not able to change/fake their finger prints.

You're auguring in circles. Like I said photo ID can be faked. Finger prints can not been faked ... there are upwards of 6B folk in this world and so far no two finger prints match ... even on the same person.
Lets see, banks, police, the FBI, DoJ, and the DoD all use finger prints and have for years as verification of ID.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Ummmm... I just explained that.

Wait til you renew the one you have now.

That's not going to be so easy once every state implements SecureID.
Like I said... wait til you go to renew your current DL. Things have changed.

Please tell me how fingerprints verify eligibility to vote.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

No you didn't.

Just did back in May 2012. Paid with my daugher's CC and the license was mailed to the address I requested. Which interesting enough was out of state.

Just did back in May 2012. Paid with my daugher's CC and the license was mailed to the address I requested. Which interesting enough was out of state.

Fingerprints don't any more than any of the other information/protocols you listed but they do verify with 100% security that you are, or are not, the person who's finger prints are on file with the state. Where as photo ID, at least under the current methodology, does not.
Which, if you read for comprehension, is how this case of stolen ID was sorted out.
http://www.seattlepi.com/news/texas/article/Kansas-case-puts-face-on-total-identity-theft-3972848.php#page-1
A quick question, how well do photo IDs differentiate between twins?
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Yeah, I did. Not my fault you didn't understand it.

Like I said... just wait til you have to renew your current DL (which obviously is the one you just got six months ago).

Do you have a reading comprehension problem? The one you got in May *is* your current DL. When *that* expires, you're going to need a birth certificate to renew it.

False. Fingerprints don't at all, period. A SecureID driver's license *does* verify citizenship.

No, it verifies that you are the person whose photo is on file... and who had to furnish a BC to get that ID.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Photo ID's, "Real" ID's, or any other ID that can't be electronically scanned and run through a computer for "bad" flags are all fatally flawed. A lot of people look alike, and the photos on ID's are small and often unclear. What's with the "gold star" on a "Real ID" DL? Does that contain coding that is scanned? Does anybody seriously think a forger can't replicate a gold star? Hell, you could get a forged U.S. Passport if you want it. WTF? There's not even a guarantee these Real ID DL's will be implemented by all states. I couldn't find anything on the Illinois DL website about Real ID. Looks like they're still doing renewals as always. Some states have passed laws against issuing Real ID. The Fed deadline for compliance has been pushed to 2017, and may be pushed out farther. So it's still a state-by-state deal. It's got nothing to do with "real" identification. It's mostly to hassle illegals, who probably can already buy "Real ID's" for a hundred bucks. But "legals" are the ones who get hassled, because they obey the law. I carried Navy and CG Merchant Mariner id for years. Nobody ever looked at the fingerprint whorls on those ID's, and the fingerprints could have been anybody's. Even if they ran the card prints through CODIS, they would have to run mine through too to prove the card and me matched. The only ID I've ever had questioned was my CC, because it was flagged due to "unusual" travel. So I had to verify it with a phone call giving "secret" info to get it working again. All this DL "Real ID' is a load of crap. "Real ID" proves nothing. It's just plain old bullshit bureaucratic nonsense. Credit card companies have the right idea, and a much better infrastructure to track who is who. But Americans trust CC companies more than the U.S. Government, so the Feds can't use that method.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

You probably will the next time. That is part of a post-9/11 law called Secure-ID. For information see: http://www.in.gov/bmv/2356.htm
--
America is at that awkward stage. It's too late
to work within the system, but too early to shoot
  Click to see the full signature.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

Yep. We just went thought that. Not only did we have to have our birth certificates, but also proof of residency. My wife had to dig out our marriage license (I'm surprised we've carted it around with us for 41 years - I guess she made sure not to destroy the evidence ;-).
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
snipped-for-privacy@att.bizzz wrote in

*My* wife had to do more than that: she needed a *certified copy* of our marriage license (we didn't have one). I had to go to the courthouse to get one, before she could renew her DL.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Interesting you mention that. My wife was born in New Orleans and we were married there. She needed a BC for some legal matter (not a DL) took us six months and several hundred dollars for a certified copy of her BC and our ML. The excuse was that the records were damaged by flood waters.
A cousin with political connections made a phone call and the documents were in our hands by express messenger by 10 AM the next day.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload


These rules are getting ridiculous. This is not for our benefit. It's for the govt's benefit to make us all afraid.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Tue, 30 Oct 2012 02:33:26 +0000 (UTC), Doug Miller

Huh? A "certified copy" is an "original" document (i.e. one issued by government). SWMBO just happened to have *the* original. If she didn't have it, it would have meant a 700mi trip to get one. She also had the copy that the minister gave us but that wasn't cutting it. ;-)
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

I ttravel out of the country a lot, but this is showing me another reason I am glad I got my passport. That qualifies for proving everything except SSN and address.
--
America is at that awkward stage. It's too late
to work within the system, but too early to shoot
  Click to see the full signature.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

How does a passport deal with name changes?
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

Long and semi-involved so here is the URL. FWIW, there is a separate way to change your passport if you are transgendered. http://travel.state.gov/passport/correcting/ChangeName/ChangeName_851.htm l
--
America is at that awkward stage. It's too late
to work within the system, but too early to shoot
  Click to see the full signature.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

I meant a name change through marriage.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

That URL is the way to change your name following marriage OR legal name change. This is for marriage/court: Your current, valid U.S. passport Completed Form DS-82, Application for a U.S. Passport by Mail Applicable "Renewal" fees An original or certified copy of your marriage certificate or the government-issued document evidencing your legal name change under federal or state law.
One recent, color photograph.
If you can't find legal documentation: You must submit the following in person at an Acceptance Facility or a Passport Agency :
Your current, valid U.S. passport A completed Form DS-11, Application for a U.S. Passport Applicable "First Time" fees
At least 3 public records showing your date and place of birth that show exclusive use of your assumed name for at least 5 years
One recent, color photograph
--
America is at that awkward stage. It's too late
to work within the system, but too early to shoot
  Click to see the full signature.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

So, in reality, there isn't any difference, just a different bureaucrat that needs to appeasement.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Related Threads

    HomeOwnersHub.com is a website for homeowners and building and maintenance pros. It is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.