NiMh batteries

Looking for recommendations for 9 volt NiMh batteries.
EBL has one they claim has a 600 mah capacity.
What about Tenergy's 200 mah battery ?
Especially interested to hear from those who have used these.
Thanks, Andy
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On 10/10/2014 8:41 PM, Andy wrote:

I recommend that you tell the list the use of said battery, and what type of device, and some of that.
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On 10/10/14, 8:41 PM, Andy wrote:

I have no experience, but I'm interested.
The Tenergy seems to have been on the market longer.
The 600 mah EBL is li-ion. EBL's 9 V NiMH is 280 mah.
When I'm checking a product out, I like to read the good reviews and the bad reviews at Amazon.
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On 10/10/2014 6:21 PM, J Burns wrote:

Pay close attention to the voltage specs. Most NiCd/NiMH 9V aren't. I have an Energizer that's 7.2V and an Empl that's 8.4V.
You'll have to check the spec on the lithium. But the voltage will vary over the 4.2V-3.5V per cell or so unless it's one of the newer lower voltage lithium poly ones. And how would you charge it?
I've had lousy luck with rechargeable 9V. Self discharge runs 'em down before I get any use out of the device.
Good news is that some devices really don't need 9V. I have a radio shack multimeter in which I replaced the 9V with three AAA NiCds and it works fine. If I used it a lot, I'd put low self-discharge cells in it.
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On Friday, October 10, 2014 8:21:19 PM UTC-5, J Burns wrote:

I am glad you caught the difference.
Andy
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Been using the Tenergy's NiMH 9V 200mAH batteries and their higher capacity 9V lithium batteries, the former for over a year in smoke detectors and other devices with no problems. Well made, no bulging like other 9V NiMH's I have used and sturdy battery snaps. White color with enough room to write date of acquisition and date of charge on the battery case, too.
They are a far cry from the very crappy 9V rechargeables I've used (apparently Micky, too) over the years that always oozed greenish goo at the terminals after a short while and would rarely ever charge back up to full voltage after just a few uses. I was reluctant to even try them but 9V alkalines are getting incredibly expensive and I have had very good luck with their AA, AAA and Roomba batteries.
One important difference is that although the lithium models are much higher capacity (500mAH if IIRC) they top out at 8.4 volts and that's low enough to make some devices unhappy - i.e. they'll complain of low voltage.
I was very skeptical at first because of bad experience with even name brand rechargeable 9V NiMH (including Eveready) but these are holding up well. Especially nice for smokes and for meters without auto shut-offs and my advancing senility which means I often forget to turn them off. (-:
Now my smoke detectors can be replaced with freshly charged batteries every 6 months without me ending up taking out batteries that may have a year left on them just to be sure they'll last. All batteries still had good voltage after six months and I left one in without recharging to see if it can make it a year. We'll know soon as the DST change is approaching. That's when I will replace all the alkalines with either the NiMH or lithium 9V batteries.
Bought two different chargers - a four-banger with separate power supply and individual LEDs and a two bay model with folding plug and with one LED for the two batteries (less nice). I did that because I wasn't sure the old charger was suitable for the lithium units (and still am not sure).
The sheet that came with the two bay models says it's good for lithium and NiMH 9V so I use the old charger for the 200mAH NiMHs and the 2 bay unit for the lithiums, just to be safe. Takes about 8 hours to charge the 500mAH lithiums, so it's clearly a slow charger (which is just fine with me considering they're lithium cells that can burn very hot if overcharged).
Tenergy alleges full capacity takes several charge cycles. I saw no increase from the 8.4V on the lithium cells and very little different in capacity (I used a little snap on LED flasher to drain them and set them up in front of a CCTV camera so I could precisely time how long they took to discharge by reviewing the recording.)
If you're interested I'll look up the exact model numbers.
To answer your question succinctly, I am very satisfied having used the NiMH Tenergy models for over a year. The lithiums are new additions and I've only had them for a few months, but so far, so good. The 500mAH capacity is great for things that can benefit from extended run time and I'll bet that like most lithium cells, they'll hold their charge far longer than the NiMH cells.
FWIW, I use dozens (maybe hundreds) of Tenergy AA and AAA LSD cells and have been very happy with their performance. I just got incredibly tired of leaking alkalines. Never had a Tenergy cell leak and they seem pretty resistant to complete discharge (although I have to recondition them if they show up as 0 volts in my LaCrosse charger).
NB that I use the charger in the slow charge mode since that seems to just about double the overall battery life compared to my Sanyo quick charger that leaves them almost too hot too touch but charges them in under two hours. The only thing I use that for now is to restore a 0 volt battery enough for the LaCrosse to see it and recondition it (about 5 minutes). The LaCrosse won't do anything to a battery that reads "null." It treats the TD battery that's been charged for five minutes as FULL but a run test indicates it's not. However a recharge cycle or two on the LaCrosse brings it back to life. Not sure what that implies, just noting it for the record.
I have two different MP3 players that take single AA and AAA cells and they make great battery capacity testers. I set them in the continuous replay mode and then record the output to Cooledit on an old tablet PC with a mini-stereo patch cord. I get a visual graph showing exactly how long they played to the second. Since the MP3 players are really old models, they have inefficient chips that drain the batteries fairly quickly so the tests run fairly quickly. Sometimes old is good!
I've found that when AA and AAA LSD cells start showing a charged voltage higher than 1.35V, they are heading for the great battery box in the sky. I also mark any battery that has fully discharged with a red Sharpie so that I don't use it again in anything critical. That's because with other NiMH batteries like Maha and Powerex, total discharge is the kiss of death. I am surprised the Tenergy cells recover so nicely from a TD.
No financial interest, just a satisfied customer who buys them from the Battery Superstore via Amazon. Reasonable and fast shipping, too.
--
Bobby G.



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On Friday, October 10, 2014 7:41:42 PM UTC-5, Andy wrote:

Thanks for the plethora of good info.
I found some good info here.
http://michaelbluejay.com/batteries/nimh-brands.html
Andy
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On Friday, October 10, 2014 8:41:42 PM UTC-4, Andy wrote:

I've been using the Tenergy Centura (low self discharge) 9V batteries in my Fluke meters with good results. They are actually 8.4V but don't seem to cause any issues. I am using them with a Maha MH-C490F charger. I picked that charger because it is listed as a "smart charger" with delta-V termina tion and also it is listed by the manufacturer to be able to charge all thr ee common types of NiMH "9V" batteries (7.2V, 8.4V or 9.6V, depending on th e actual number of NiMH cells used inside. A traditional 9V carbon-zinc or alkaline battery will actually have six 1.5V AAAA cells inside, whereas a NiMH cell is 1.2V nominal hence the voltages listed above.)
Maha themselves do make 9.6V batteries both normal and LSD ("Imedion") if y ou find a device that doesn't work well on the 8.4V batteries however the T energy seemed to be a better price/quality balance after some online resear ch when I bought them, and they've been working well for me so far. In fac t for my occasional use they haven't even needed a recharge yet. I'm also using a Tenergy Centura D cell in my Simpson 260 (7m) in addition to a Cent ura "9V" and that is working well also. I was worried that due to the Simp son being a rather simple meter that the voltage difference would cause iss ues but it has not.
nate
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On 10/11/14, 9:33 AM, N8N wrote:

I test the amps of alkaline batteries because a perfectly good battery may have much less than the nominal open-cell voltage. In the past, my problems with rechargeables have come when the voltage under load fell below 1.2. A few charge-discharge cycles may improve that.
The Simpson 260 shouldn't be fussy about D-cell voltage. The ohms-adjust compensates for differences. I think the D cell is only for Rx1.
Based on your experience, I may start using NiMH 9V batteries.
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On 10/11/2014 8:39 PM, J Burns wrote:

Do you load test, or just drop a dead short?
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On 10/11/14, 9:25 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Dead short.
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On 10/11/2014 11:04 PM, J Burns wrote:

What amp ranges have you seen?
Q: What do basketball players wear when they die? A: Dead shorts.
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On Sunday, October 12, 2014 7:38:21 AM UTC-4, Stormin Mormon wrote:

One of the advantages to NiMH is that they have lower internal resistance than alkalines, so the 1.2V nominal voltage may be less of a drawback relative to alkalines as load increases.
nate
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On 10/12/2014 10:59 AM, N8N wrote:

have lower internal resistance than alkalines, so the 1.2V nominal voltage may be less of a drawback relative to alkalines as load increases.

I went to the fire dept open house today. Decided to take some pictures. Sadly, the AA NIMH only lasted a dozen or so pics, and no flash. Swap em out with the ones in my mini mag, also no joy.
Time for some new cells. I had some older alkaline batteries in my other pocket, but they only lasted a few frames. Can't win.
. Christopher A. Young Learn about Jesus www.lds.org .
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On Sunday, October 12, 2014 3:23:54 PM UTC-4, Stormin Mormon wrote:

I had the same issue with a cheap Nikon digicam years back. I could put a fresh set of NiMH in it and get off maybe 6-7 shots, less if I used flash, before it "died." The cells still had plenty of charge, but the camera wou ld recognize the cells as "dead." I even tried using Nikon-branded cells i nstead of whatever NiMH I was using at the time (I hadn't yet discovered En eloops) but still no dice. Oddly the camera actually had a setting in the menu for NiMH vs. alkaline cells so apparently Nikon expected me to use the m. Unfortunately Nikon CS seemed spectacularly uninterested in the issue, so it was never satisfactorily resolved - I used Energizer Lithiums in it u ntil it became obsolete (by the fact that eventually your average cell phon e contained a better camera than that unit) and I stopped using it.
The really odd thing is that I've used Eneloops in tons of devices *not* sp ecifically designed for them with no issue whatsoever. Just that one camer a wasn't happy.
nate
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On 10/12/14, 7:38 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

A new AA might show 5 amps or more. 3 amps may work in many devices. 1 amp is low. Internal resistance increases as an alkaline battery is used up. Assuming an open circuit voltage of 1.5 V,
5 amps would mean about 3/10 ohms of internal resistance. 3 amps would mean 5/10 ohm. 1 amp would mean 1.5 ohm.
Energizer says a brief short is harmless. If I'm checking an assortment of AA's, surge current is a quick way to tell which ones to discard. Open-circuit voltage doesn't seem to work as well.
I also use current to check 9 V batteries, but I don't do it enough to remember what a new one should produce. I just check a suspect battery against a new one.
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On 10/12/2014 6:10 PM, J Burns wrote:

I might do some testing, here. Yesterday I was out of the house, and wanted to take some pictures with my digicam. The NiMH I had in would take one or two, and then shut down. Swapped with the set in my mini mag, and they did much the same. I had a four pack of older alkaline cells, for jut that reason. Seven or so years old. And they did much the same.
Home, tried some fresh charged NiMH which worked fine. I have some Energizer Lithium, might put those in my jacket pocket instead.
Only one fire department open house a year, and I got a couple pictures. Got some last year and they did much the same activities. This year, I got to squirt the hose, and use a dry chem extinguisher. Actually put out the fire, last year I did not put it out.
. Christopher A. Young Learn about Jesus www.lds.org .
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On 10/13/14, 10:26 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

http://www.powerstream.com/AA-tests.htm
Here are charts showing how fast the voltage of alkaline cells drops under loads. I hadn't heard of the Energizer Titanium. (E2 is lithium.)
Years ago, I found that a pair of AA NiCds would power a krypton bulb, drawing nearly an amp, better than alkalines. In those days, NiMH wouldn't supply that kind of power as reliably as NiCd, it seemed to me.
To avoid shorting rechargeables, I use a battery holder with a 1-ohm resistor. After about 300mah, an Eneloop is down to about 1.25 V, and it stays up around there through most of its discharge. I like that!
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On 10/14/2014 9:04 AM, J Burns wrote:

Thank you, may have seen that page before.
I did some deadshort tests on AA cells, averaging 1.2 to 1.3 amps, some were under 1.0. I didn't get the wide range of values I'd expected.
Might need to replace my LSD NiMH cells that I use for camera and mini mag. They have been in service a couple years. I also changed to carrying lithium AA in my jacket pocket as backups. The older Maxell alkalines didn't do the job.
Like the sound of those Enelopps, they might be my next purchase.
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<The really odd thing is that I've used Eneloops in tons of devices *not* specifically designed for them with no issue whatsoever. Just that one camera wasn't happy.>
Almost all of the Nikon Prosumer cameras of that era wouldn't work well with rechargeables. They apparently set the "low battery" cut-off voltage way too high.
The Coolpix 2000 would at least take a rechargeable lithium pack but the 950 through 990 models wouldn't and worse, still, had crappy battery doors with plastic tabs that failed on every single camera I've seen (and I bought a lot of them used on Ebay). Every stinking one including a NIB one that I bought. Opened it up, loaded AA alkalines and POP. The tabs failed. Not only that, but the high cap NiMH batteries of that era wouldn't fit because the battery slots weren't large enough to accept the slightly oversized (in diameter) cells like the 2300mAH Mahas.
Great auto-white balance, even under mixed lighting, a swivel head and superb macro capabilities but an Achilles heel that made them worthless for using away from a power supply. Eventually I found a lithium ion rechargeable pack that attached via the tripod screw and fed in through the DC in port, but it was a kludge.
Because it's so good at closeups I keep a Coolpix 950 on my workbench to track projects as I disassemble things but it's hooked to an AC power supply plugged into a UPS. Just one second power blips reset the time and date. It's really, really sad that they made such a great camera with such a fatal defect.
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