Motion Detecting Lights in Bathrooms - Code??

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wrote:

I've tried them for years and have also been disappointed. They are slow to reach full brightness. I've had several burnouts. No way can you count "long life" as an asset especially if you're paying a significant premium for them vs. Incandescent. Over time their color temperature (and brightness) decays toward yellows. The one exception is a special "Day Light" rated bulb which cost me $8.95 + tax. If I could find these where I live now (no Menards in AZ), I buy a few more but CFLs are definetly on my "watch, don't buy." list now.
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DonC wrote:

None that I have purchased in the last few years has been slow to reach full brightness. Long life is an asset if you factor in your time to replace burned out incandescents even at minimum wage given the large number of incandescents you'd replace over the life of one CFL. I've not found any notable change in color temperature or brightness except for during the first and last ~5 hrs of CFL life, the thousands of hours in between are quite constant. The nominal 75% power savings over the life of the CFL more than makes up for the cost difference. Your local lighting supplier should either have the "daylight" color spectrum CFLs or be able to order them for you.
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My last issue of Consumer Reports did a spread on CFL's. I remember reading that the bulbs should not be used for all locations. If the light will not be on for more that 15 minutes, it should continue to use an incandescent. CFL's that are not kept on for 15 minutes or longer will have a shorter life expectancy.
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wrote:

I am going to mostly agree, but with exceptions. I bought some of the original CFLs about 6 years ago. They were two straight tubes that formed a "U shape". Of the 3 that I bought, one was in a bedroom light and lasted 3 to 4 years and were placed horizontal. Two were in a kitchen fixture where they sit base at a 45deg angle upward. That fixture is on almost 24/7. Once and awhile I shut it off during the day, but it's always on all night as a security light. One died last year after about 5 years, the other is still working fine. These bulbs come on almost instantly. good color, etc. I was and still am well pleased with them. Their only drawbacks are they are long (about 8 inches). They either dont fit in most fixtures or look kind of stupid hanging out the end of an open fixture. Their other drawback, they are no longer sold.
Then they came out with these spiral CFLs. In my opinion, they are JUNK - JUNK - JUNK...... I have tried several brands. All are slow to light (some worse than others). My biggest complaint is that they are short lived, and I have had some literally go up in smoke. I cant complain about the color or light output (if I get the larger wattage ones), but the full output takes quite awhile. I cant think of one of them that has lasted any longer than a common indecesant bulb. Some do not fit in fixtures, but git better than those I mentioned above. In a cold garage or shed, they are useless in winter. I just replace them in winter with standard bulbs out there.
I am one person who was really sold on them, but am slowly getting rid of most of them now. In my "always on" security light, I hope to be able to find something that lasts, when my last "old" one burns out, or I will just replace the fixture with a florescent tube. In outdoor buildings and fixtures, most are gone now. In my bathroom, they are gone (I want instant full brightness). In extremely flammable situations, they are also gone after having several of them spark and smoke.
At one time I had nearly every fixture in the house and out buildings with them. The porch light and a few other places were the only standard bulbs. I probably had 90% of all fixtures with CFLs. Now, I probably only have 30% of them, and as they die, I just replace them with standard bulbs. I am very disappointed with the newest ones.
Alvin
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snipped-for-privacy@notmail.com wrote:

Are you talking about the 13 watt twintube? F13TT? PL-13? That plugs into a ballast-adapter? If so, those are still sold. They are available at home centers, electrical/lighting supply shops, and some (but not all) hardware stores.
Or are you talking about quadtube and 6-tube screw base models? Those should still be available at electrical/lighting supply shops and online lightbulb outfits such as bulbs.com.

For better life expectancy, I would:
* Get ones that have the "Energy Star" logo * Preferably get ones of "Big 3" brands (GE, Philips, Sylvania). Target has GE ones and Lowes has Sylvania ones. NOTE - The "usual color" of Sylvania is not 2700K but a pinkish shade of 3000 K - it could look on the harsh side.
* Be wary of Lights of America. I had a lot of early failures and saw many die young in locations that I frequented in my delivery job. DISCLAIMER - I have only bought one LOA since 2001.
* Do not get dollar store junkers.
* Be wary of the few remaining older stock 25 watt spirals - there was a bad production run of those.
* Not use spirals over 19 watts or so in small enclosed fixtures or downlights.

There are special outdoor CFLs with outer bulbs. However, they have a severe warmup requirement, even more so than bare spirals.

So far, I have only experienced spectacular burnouts of dollar store junkers and one Lights of America unit. If the CFL is an integral ballast one (as in the usual screw base ones, as opposed to PL types and the like), they are normally UL listed. Avoid screw base CFLs that are not UL listed. Most dollar store junkers are not.

Porch lights are actually a good place for CFLs since they normally have long on-time per start. But use outdoor ones such as Philips SL/O.

- Don Klipstein ( snipped-for-privacy@misty.com)
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On Mon, 08 Oct 2007 12:38:52 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@gannon.edu wrote:

When you use electric heat.
--
77 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
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snipped-for-privacy@gannon.edu wrote:
...

They are getting better and cheaper now.

that most all residential power meters are just "real" power, not apparent power.

fuel heat is typically about half the cost of electricity (YMMV), so you still have savings (but less) during heating season.

use CFLs in fixtures with a greater light output than the max size incandescent that I can safely put in that fixture, and still get acceptable lifetimes.

and with base down. Hardly typical. And then it is compared to the least efficient version of an incandescent bulb that they could find. Look past the BS marketing.

use incandescents in many other places.
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Residential electric meters do indeed read only "real" power. Power factor is not an issue there.
<EDIT FOR SPACE>

Most of the time, I find a brand-new CFL at optimum temperature to match the output of incandescents near the high end of light output for the claimed "equivalent wattage".
Exceptions:
* 23 watt ones (mostly claim 100 watt equivalence, while I find them more like "90 watt" equivalence)
* In my experience, many Lights of America and Maxlite models were dimmer than others of same claimed light output
* Some daylight models in my experience fall a little short
* Dollar store junkers - BIGTIME!!! - along with other issues that make them outright stool specimens!
- Don Klipstein ( snipped-for-privacy@misty.com)
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What's really annoying about mandating "energy saving" devices like that is that for those of us that conscientiously turn off lights when leaving a room, we wind up with higher electric bills as our lights are always on five minutes longer than necessary , not to mention the $30 to $50 for the switch

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I haven't seen any of the timer switches that don't allow to you manually control the light as well.
-frank
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That's true, but the switch is typically an inconvenient three position slide type that's a pita to operate


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Switch out with regular switches if tyou dont like them.

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Yes, it is.

You said it yourself, to save electricity. An occupant sensor is now required in many rooms, incl. bathroom & kitchen, unless you use energy efficient bulbs.
-frank
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Surely these get disabled in the majority of bathrooms as soon as the owner figures out how to do it? Or am I the only person who doesn't *want* all the lights to come on when nature calls at night?
--
snipped-for-privacy@phred.org is Joshua Putnam
<http://www.phred.org/~josh/
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'morning' subroutine in my head, and I can forget about getting back to sleep.
I'll control how the lighting circuits in my damn house work, thank you very much NannyState. I'm no wastrel- I keep things pretty dark. But <I> choose what goes on and off, and when.
aem sends...
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wrote:

I have motion lights all over my house for "walking around light" at a low level and once you get used to them you won't want to go back to switches. I also have "task lighting" that is switch controlled when you need it. This all started with a motioned controlled light in the kitchen because the wife and kids were using the refrigerator as a night light.
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Oops- accidently send via e-mail instead of posting. (Gotta quit using Usenet to distract me when sinuses wake me up at 0300....
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 3:36 AM Subject: Re: Motion Detecting Lights in Bathrooms - Code??

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wrote:

I put a string on LED holiday lights in my bathroom. I don't need anything else just to pee.
--
112 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
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clipped

http://www.energy.ca.gov/2005publications/CEC-400-2005-005/chapters_4q/6_Lighting.pdf
It talks about "luminaires" and "occupant sensors". Is "luminaire" Californiaese for "light bulb"? Sounds like it is a code requirement. California is the place with overloaded elec. demands in hot weather, right?
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http://my.earthlink.net/article/top?guid 070903/46db86c0_3ca6_1552620070903-957147757
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