Long turn vs. short turn 90deg elbow: sanitary from toilets

Hi. I'm replacing the cast iron 4" sanitary lines to my two bathrooms with PVC. They drop vertically from each bathroom and turn 90degrees to horizontal in the basement. This turn is via existing long turn/long sweep elbows.
Is there any problem if I switch these to short turn 90 deg elbows? I'd li ke to regain the headroom in the basement and keep these pipes within the c eiling joist level, instead of having these stick out below the (future) fi nished ceiling level in the basement. I can't find anything in the plumbin g codes on this. All advice appreciated.
Thanks Theodore.
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On 2015-10-12 11:06 AM, snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

There is probably no problem doing that, but just in case, use elbows with a cleanout.
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On Mon, 12 Oct 2015 11:18:22 -0400, FrozenNorth

There is no such thing as an elbow with a cleanout.
But there are tees, which can be used as an elbow and the third opening can become the cleanout with another fitting made to be a cleanout.
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On 2015-10-13 1:32 AM, snipped-for-privacy@spamblocked.com wrote:

I am not a plumber, the tee was just an idea if he was cheating the corner, didn't all have to be one piece.
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In typed:

Are you also replacing the vertical sewer pipe that comes down from the two toilets (and/or are they just coming through from the first floor right above the basement)?
If so, you can probably switch from 4" cast iron to 3 " PVC. That in itself may give you more room and may even allow you to use 3" sweep 90 deg elbows.
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More info: Yes, I'm replacing all pipes, but I'd rather not tempt fate and reduce overall size of pipe diameter. That would really make me nervous.
Pipe slope is not an issue. I will guarantee to maintain that no matter what I do.
Difference between 4" long sweep and 4" short sweep elbow is definitely noticeable. But other than rule-of-thumb to leave what was there, is there any specific code requirement or plumbing rule that says vert-to-horiz turn MUST be long-sweep.
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On Mon, 12 Oct 2015 09:59:54 -0700 (PDT), snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

I've never seen "long sweep" elbows used for sanitary drains.
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In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 12 Oct 2015 15:14:42 -0400, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

So what are they used for?
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wrote:

Don't know - never seen them used.
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In alt.home.repair, on Mon, 12 Oct 2015 22:03:14 -0400, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

ROFL
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wrote:

Here in Ontario, in residential applications, the standard radius fittings appear to be "the standard" - everything tucks up nice and neat between the floor joists and the majority of basements are finished living space, Second story bathrooms and 2 story and split level houses are more common than bungalows, and the "standard" fittings mean no bulges or bulkheads are required to fit sanitary sewer connections. Large radius fittings are occaisionally used for 1 1/2" or 2" sink and laundry drains, but even there, they would be the exception tather than the rule.. In the vast majority of cases the WC/Toilet is close to the vertical rizer/stack with no horizontal bends - the "run" is straight from the flange to the stack, which runs from the pipes under the basement floor slab straight up to the stack vent in the roof, with all sink drains etc joining into the vertical stack as well. Sometimes a house will have 2 stacks if there are bathrooms at opposite ends of the house.
I quess I HAVE seen the long radius 4" used in horizontal bends under slabs, when I come to think of it - but even there, they are not "common". Horizontal bends in the framed flooring
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In alt.home.repair, on Tue, 13 Oct 2015 00:17:13 -0400, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

This is not as funny as your first answer, but thanks.
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On Mon, 12 Oct 2015 08:06:27 -0700 (PDT), snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

Long sweeps are virtually NEVER used for the reason you stated. "90"s "T" and "T-Y" fittings are pretty well the only thing used.
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snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com posted for all of us...

I don't think so. Why not add a clean-out while doing it? Might help later.
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On Mon, 12 Oct 2015 08:06:27 -0700 (PDT), snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

They used a long sweep for a reason. Remember, solids go down, not just water. You could raise the toilets on a platform made from 2X8's and plywood decking, in the bathrooms. That would make for more headroom in the basement. And just think, when you sat on those raised toilets, you would really feel like a king sitting on the THRONE !!!!
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Yes, but the Queen would definitely not approve of such a solution.
Interestingly, I'm reading alot of the posts on this thread that sound like suggestions and recommendations, but no one is coming right out and saying "I'm a licensed plumber and [long-sweep or short sweep] is STANDARD PRACTI CE or IBC-requirement for plumbing a toilet and so you should do [xyz metho d]."
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On Mon, 12 Oct 2015 20:57:28 -0700 (PDT), snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

I'm not a licenced plumber, but the last 3 houses I've lived in, as well as the last 3 houses my father lived in (2 of which he built) all used the "standard radius" fittings. I've done work in several of the houses in my neighbourhood - all in the 40 year old range - and they are also all "standard radius" 4" plastic drains. I put in a basement bath and laundry in my daughter's house and finished the basement. I had a licenced plumber work with me on the under-slab modifications to the sanitary drain - and everything was done with "standard radius" bends with the possible exception of one "45" required to connect the laundry under the slab - and that was not a 4 inch pipe.
That said, this is Ontario Canada, and we do things a bit differently up here than in most of the USA - like installing electrical service panels SIDEWAYS more often than upright - particularly when replacing old fuse panels. (Just had mine replaced last week - and installing it "upright" would have involved some major rework and/or a bunch of junction boxes to extend the wiring to reach the bottom of the panel, while mounting it sideways - with the main disconnect on the left, didn't require relocating a single wire other than the feed from the meter base (which was also replaced) needing to be raised 4 inches.
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On Tuesday, October 13, 2015 at 12:29:11 AM UTC-4, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote :

t

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u

ike suggestions and recommendations, but no one is coming right out and say ing "I'm a licensed plumber and [long-sweep or short sweep] is STANDARD PRA CTICE or IBC-requirement for plumbing a toilet and so you should do [xyz me thod]."

The long sweep elbows offer less resistance to flow. If you're plumbing up a vent system for a furnace for example, where you're only allowed a certain number of feet and turns to keep within the max resistance limit, the long sweep offer less resistance. Same thing with a water or waste pipe, I'd always use a long if it would work. But sometimes other factors come into play. IDK what code might say.
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On Monday, October 12, 2015 at 10:06:42 AM UTC-5, snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

C. They drop vertically from each bathroom and turn 90degrees to horizonta l in the basement. This turn is via existing long turn/long sweep elbows.

like to regain the headroom in the basement and keep these pipes within the ceiling joist level, instead of having these stick out below the (future) finished ceiling level in the basement. I can't find anything in the plumb ing codes on this. All advice appreciated.

Sewer, soil, or septic...but certainly not sanitary! ʘل͟? ?
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