bob haller wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@g4g2000yqk.googlegroups.com:
I have a 150 Watt inverter and finally got a friend to help hooking it up to the furnace (we went 99 hours without power in NE NJ, 07410). Furnace is natural gas-fired, circulating hot water. The inverter hookup worked fine, but I had to have the engine running, of course. It is OK for short emergencies, but I'd like better. Will be looking ...
150 watts looks a bit small to me for running a furnace. Are you sure it wasn't a 1,500 watt unit? O_o
TDD
The Daring Dufas wrote in news:k76ccf$foa$ snipped-for-privacy@dont-email.me:
I am sure. The furnace only needs electricity to run a small circulating pump, plus power up a solenoid for the damper. Plus, it did work . But I don't like to sacrifice my only vehicle for this if I can avoid it.
That's right, you did write that it is circulating hot water. I assume it doesn't have a draft inducer blower like many boilers/furnaces. Is it one of those small Taco pumps? They don't use very much power. ^_^
TDD
The Daring Dufas wrote in news:k76faa $7n0$ snipped-for-privacy@dont-email.me:
Yes, a Taco, 1/25 hp, using it says 0.76 Amps.
The Saturn 1.9 is 85HP at 5000 rpm in original form, and 100HP at
5000 with multiport injection.Torque at 2400 is 107 and 115 respectively.
Assuming 80% torque is available at 1800 RPM, the early engine would produce [ (.8X107)X1800/5252] =29.33 Hp
The multiport engine, under the same assumption, would produce [(.8X115)X1800/5252] = 31.53 HP
Assuming 80% of maximum rated torque on an engine without variable valve timing is being quite generous, from my experience.
I'd call 25 and 27 HP pretty realistic.
Also, idle consumption and full load consumption at 1800 RPM have absolutely nothing in common. Specific fuel consumption at 1800 RPM MAY aproach 0..4 per HP Hour. That would mean ABOUT 10 lbs per hour for the low powered engine. At 6 lbs per american gallon of regular gasoline, we are looking at just under 1.5 gallons per hour, so about
3.3 hours at full load - of approxemately 15 KW with an average generator head and a reasonably well set up belt drive. At anything less than full output, the efficiency would drop quite a bit, so half load MIGHT give you 5 hours of running.Take off the OEM fuel injection system and replace with a custom tuneable unit, and retime the camshaft to move the torque peak down closer to the running speed, and you could perhaps improve efficiency a bit and squeeze, say, 7 hours at half load out of the system.
You lucked out on your heating system. If you have a gas water heater you can live like civilized people without electricity. ^_^
TDD
The Daring Dufas wrote in news:k76h54 $hne$ snipped-for-privacy@dont-email.me:
Yep, we lucked out on that point and many others. The house is well- insulated, so even with only 2 people rattling around inside, it only got as cool as 58° for a little bit. That is endurable. We had cellphones working (recharge from car), LED flashlights, a propane Coleman lantern for bright light (only one), functioning stove and water heater. I even have a propane catalytic heater (Mr. Heater portable Buddy), but I was a little hesitant using it in an enclosed space.
You're lucky. We could not get gas when our house was built. Oil furnace with blower takes a lot of juice. So does well. I've got 5,500 watt generator but hot water, stove and AC are all off line when power fails. Well, furnace, freezer and refrigerator were main reasons I got a generator and no way could these be handled off an inverter.
Frank wrote in news:k76ihq$tsp$ snipped-for-privacy@dont-email.me:
Given a choice, I don't understand why anyone would buy a home that didn't have natural gas. I do understand that sometimes there is no choice. We had an oil furnace in our previous home, but it was expensive to run, stinky and not very reliable. There was gas for the stove. OK, the furnace was an old system. I would definitely ditch it for a gas furnace if I'd had to replace it. With gusto if I had known in advance that gas would drop in price by as much as it has. Luckily, where I have lived there has always been municipal water, gas of some sort, and electricity. Except for a few years, there has always been a sewer system as well.
Keep in mind..that 3600 rpm engines are using 4 times as much fuel as a 800 rpm engine. Which is why the good gensets only run at 1800 rpm. They took subsized engines, hooked them up to a genny and run them hard in order to keep the hp ratings up. Which works..but its hard on the engine and hard on the fuel bills.
The new whizbang engines do exactly the same thing with the new computers and they can be yanked out by the roots and installed on the standby, though its a bit more complicated because so few of them have a distributor anymore. Hence my suggestion about older engines with a distributor for the hamhanded or those without a decent shop manual for the engine/vehicle in question.
Gunner
-- "President Obama is not going to lose. He will be re-elected. It is those of you who have these grand fantasies of that pip-squeak Romney actually having a chance at winning the election that will have to wake up to reality the day after the election. I hear there is plenty of room in the rest of the world where you can reside and establish new citizenship. Kirby Grant,
Im surprised the 150 watt inverter worked. Thats not a terribly large capacity. At the least..Id have hooked up a 400 watt. Start up current for the average motor is pretty high and the furnace is a lot of ons and offs.
Thats something like (1) amp at 110vts. with a 150 watt inverter..and most motors will draw at least 4-5 on startup.
The 150 watt inverters work fine for things like camera battery chargers, electric shavers and the like..but thats about all.
Gunner
-- "President Obama is not going to lose. He will be re-elected. It is those of you who have these grand fantasies of that pip-squeak Romney actually having a chance at winning the election that will have to wake up to reality the day after the election. I hear there is plenty of room in the rest of the world where you can reside and establish new citizenship. Kirby Grant,
You were right at the limit of that inverter. Just a heads up.
Gunner
-- "President Obama is not going to lose. He will be re-elected. It is those of you who have these grand fantasies of that pip-squeak Romney actually having a chance at winning the election that will have to wake up to reality the day after the election. I hear there is plenty of room in the rest of the world where you can reside and establish new citizenship. Kirby Grant,
And if its run at an idle with say...4kw load? 15kw is a hell of a loadout. I dont pull but 2kw with just the basic...CF lights, reefer motor, and a TV or radio, plus the blower for the gas furnace. Make that 2.5kw on furnace startup.
Ill have to see if I can get ahold of Gene, he documented his usages pretty well and I know he runs his homestead on that engine/genset for about 4 days on 20 gallons of fuel. At an idle.
My genset here at the homestead is a 4kw Onan and it runs everything nicely, including the popcorn popper (grin) on about 1/3 gallon an hour with everything running balls to the wall. Its an 1800 rpm twin cylinder motor out of a wrecked motorhome.
Which btw..is another good place to find gensets.
Gunner
Gunner
-- "President Obama is not going to lose. He will be re-elected. It is those of you who have these grand fantasies of that pip-squeak Romney actually having a chance at winning the election that will have to wake up to reality the day after the election. I hear there is plenty of room in the rest of the world where you can reside and establish new citizenship. Kirby Grant,
Oh...I went to sleep one night with my 3.0 Ford Ranger idling out front and didnt remember it was running..and 2 days later, got ready to go to work...walked out..and my truck was running. Used about 3/4 of a 14 gallon tank of gas.
Just a heads up.
Gunner
-- "President Obama is not going to lose. He will be re-elected. It is those of you who have these grand fantasies of that pip-squeak Romney actually having a chance at winning the election that will have to wake up to reality the day after the election. I hear there is plenty of room in the rest of the world where you can reside and establish new citizenship. Kirby Grant,
There was a well known party girl here in town who'd get sloppy drunk and not remember where/what went on many nights. She left her little Toyota idling outside of the local hangout over a weekend and found it Monday morning happily idling in wait. I never walk away from a vehicle unless I secure it and lock it even if I'm letting it warm up. ^_^
TDD
There are a lot of older homes in my area that I describe as having an "octopus" furnace in the basement. The furnaces were originally coal fired and you can still see the coal bins and coal chute in many of the old homes. The supply ducts slope diagonally up to the main floor like limbs of a tree or octopus tentacles and the air flow is via convection with no blower and the ducts are fairly large in diameter. All of them I've ever seen were converted to natural gas in the middle of the last century but as inefficient as the beasts may be, they will keep a home warm in the winter during a power outage. ^_^
TDD
Depends on the make and model. Better quality inverters quote their running watts, but have a much higher motor start(peak) rating.
You are obviously using something less than 150 Watts and that's only when it's running. Think about a 100 W solar panel. If your ''on'' time is less than 50%, you should be good to go with not all that big a battery. In fact you would never discharge it very much so you should get good service life.
Check with your local gas supplier about available rebates for installing a high-efficiency gas furnace. I replaced the rickety,
20-year-old gas furnace in my daughter's house with a new 97% efficient unit and received a $800 rebate from the gas company.---- Diogenes
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