LED bulbs not so bad

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I've read all the threads on LED light bulbs. Not a lotta good things to say. Directional, wrong spectrum, etc. Me? I like 'em, so far.
I have a regular shaded lamp with a CFL in it. Takes at least 30-60 secs to come up to full brightness. For reading, I have one of those flex-neck lamps with a directional hood (like pole lamps). I put a 60W LED bulb in it. I bought the cheapest bulb I could find at WallyWorld fer $2.58. In a directional hooded lamp, it works great. Full brightness, instantly. Plenty bright enough fer reading when bounced off a white wall.
Not that I endorse them, without reservation. I'll be damned if I'll spend $1K+ fer an LED grow light. Not until they settle on what spectrums are best fer veg/flowering, first. But, fer a couple bucks, good enough fer reading. ;)
nb
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On 11/27/2015 4:31 PM, notbob wrote:

I saw some 60 equivalent watt units listed for $0.99 recently...

Depends on how you expect to use them.
Here, most "area lighting" is from recessed cans. So, very easy to find an effective LED lamp that pushed all its light out *one* "end". CFL's, by comparison, try to throw most of their light out the *sides* so not-quite-so-good.
Temperature performance of CFL's also makes them less than ideal. No so with LED's.
When dimmable BR30's and R20's become more affordable, we'll switch to them and just keep a couple of CFL's for (bedside) "reading lamps" (where the light needs to radiate in all directions) and (big) CFL "floods" for the up-lights in the office.
Still looking for high intensity floods (LED, probably) for the recessed cans in the garage (high ceiling means they have to throw a lot of light)
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Don Y wrote:

lights on new cars. They're like LCD display, narrow view of angle.
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On 11/27/2015 7:00 PM, Tony Hwang wrote:

That's why you put *optics* in front of them!
We've been very pleased with the LED headlights on our vehicle (haven't ever been *behind* it to comment on tail lights). Oncoming vehicles frequently flash their "brights" suggesting they think *we* have ours on (but we don't).
Turn signals illuminate the overhead signs ("next exit 2 miles").
Time will tell how they fare with our heat...
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Don Y wrote:

If you try to see LED tail lights from about 45 deg. angle it is very hard to see if it's on or off. When I remote start my car from a distance, it is little difficult to confirm car is started and running. When driving in blowing snow LED lights seem to glare more. And under the sheet of thin ice in winter.(maybe because it does not produce some heat like old lights) Also replacement LED light assembly will cost more. (can't replace individual element in an array)
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On 11/27/2015 7:57 PM, Tony Hwang wrote:

As I said, I've never seen the back of the car...

We don't have snow -- or ice.

Yes, headlights have been expensive for more than a decade. Last vehicle they were $400/each.
Of course, you typically only pay that when you've collided with something. I can't recall the last time I *replace* a headlight (from wear).
I am much more concerned with all the electronic kit that I'm at the mercy of a dealer to replace/repair. (I can still drive a car during daylight hours with a bad headlight; I can't drive it if any of the ECU's fail!)
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I think this issue was resolved several yrs ago, but I could be wrong.
I recall fans of Suzuki motorcycles were outraged when they discovered they hadda replace an entire 4-LED light array, at huge cost, instead of a single small LED bulb. Suzy changed it to easily replaceable individual LEDs.
I've seen the same issue with the newer LED stoplight assys. Usta see a few individual LED bulbs burned out. No more. Seems it's the total array or nothing. This is weird, as the Japanese usta live/die for selling entire assemblies. Are the arrays now cheaper or is it jes companies maximizing profits?
nb
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On 11/28/2015 8:19 AM, notbob wrote:

AFAICT, this varies with the make/model of the vehicle.

I think they are minimizing *production* costs. In our case, each "headlamp assembly" consists of 5 LED emitters -- 3 for "low" and 2 more for "high" -- mated to optics that focus the light in the desired dispersal pattern.
Making this an assembly means you reduce the labor involved in aiming 5 individual elements along with their optics. You have two connectors instead of 5 (for each lamp), two wiring harnesses instead of 5, etc.
As with many "production economies", this comes at the expense of *repair* costs (different from "maintenance" costs as the headlamps have high life expectancy -- higher than incandescent *or* HID; at least, "on paper" :> ).
Playing krinkle-bumper is where this turns up, in most cases. Who cares if the bulb is $20 if the PLASTIC assembly into which it fits is $400? Now it's a $420 bulb! (DIYer can't "fix" the molded plastic assembly *and* optics)
Likewise, crumple zones mean little accidents (that previously would have transferred the impact energy to your neck, spine, etc.) now transfer it to the body shop!
As I said, I am more concerned with all the electronics kit littered around the vehicle (true of virtually all vehicles nowadays). None of it likes heat -- yet most of it is exposed to heat in the normal course of events (esp in the engine compartment).
We test drove a vehicle with forward facing "technology" (camera, "RADAR", etc.) mounted just inside the front windshield (forward of the rear view mirror).
Sitting in the running vehicle while waiting for the sales droid, I watched error messages pop up on the driver's information display in rapid succession: - forward-facing-technology-feature #3 failure - forward-facing-technology-feature #1 failure - forward-facing-technology-feature #2 failure - forward-facing-technology-feature #4 failure (I forget the names of these individual features).
Of course, it was easy to suss out that each of these features was related to the bit of technology packaged "inside the windshield"!
When I asked the sales droid, his reply: "Oh, it does that when sitting out in the sun" (WTF? Are we only supposed to drive AT NIGHT??)
Turns out the problem is related to heat build-up in a *stationary* vehicle -- air flowing over the windshield normally acts to cool this stuff (doesn't happen when you're parked *in* the sunshine).
Likewise, it's relatively easy to find "bugs" in the systems in most vehicles -- without looking too hard! :< I was able to crash the "infotainment system" in a Nissan (Murano, IIRC) purely by chance -- in the few minutes I was playing with it.
I've already started a list of "anomalous behaviors" that I've observed in the various bits of technology. Some are just consequences of the implementation (e.g., if passenger and driver each have key fobs on their persons, vehicle tends to think first occupant is driver -- regardless of where seated!), some are poor design choices and others are "implementation screwups".
Thankfully, most of the design choices *seem* to have been well thought out. In looking back at other vehicles, some of the same features were present but implemented differently -- in less "friendly" manners.
E.g., when vehicle is in reverse, many vehicles automatically tilt the side mirrors downward so you can see what you are "backing into/onto". Some cars tilt both mirrors. Some cars tilt one or the other (configured by a user "setting" in a "configuration mode").
This vehicle puts that choice in the driver's hands at "run time" in a reasonably intuitive manner: - if the "side mirror select" switch (with which the driver normally chooses left, right or neither mirror to adjust with the "joystick" on the arm rest) is in the "none"/center position, both side mirrors remain "as is" when the vehicle is in reverse. - if the side mirror select switch is set to "driver's side mirror" (i.e., as if the driver would have wanted to adjust the driver's side mirror with the joystick), then the left mirror tilts downward when the car reverses - ditto for passenger's side mirror So, leave the switch in the center if you want to disable the "feature" (this also prevents you from accidentally disturbing the normal setting of the mirror by locking out the joystick). If you decide you need some help on one side or the other while backing up, just flip the switch to that side and the selected mirror moves downward.
[I've not checked to see what happens if you try to use the joystick at this time]
Other vehicles had cameras mounted around the vehicle to expose various views in the dash mounted display. IIRC, the Nissan had a downward facing camera in the passenger's side mirror that would let you watch the *curb* line while parking!
These sorts of features are an excellent example of why -- contrary to most *naive* engineer's opinions -- providing too much flexibility in configuration is A Bad Thing; most users would be intimidated and not exploit *any* of that ability -- let alone exploit it *wisely*!
One notable deficiency is a lack of *useful* information in an already BLOATED "owner's manual". There are many things that are not well documented. And, many others that could benefit from some detailed examples. I guess they expect you to get this information from an on-line forum, dealer, etc. And, of course, there are obvious documentation "errors" (cases where the software has evolved but the documentation hasn't kept pace).
Then, there are amusing omissions! E.g., the navigation system can litter the map display with icons for hospitals, libraries, food stores, ATM's, dealerships (of course!), etc. But, no way to see where police stations are located! (I've not checked fire stations or post offices, yet). Amusing when you consider those things are probably more permanent (less likely to change than Joe's Generic Restaurant) than most of the "data" that WILL change almost monthly!
Currently, the biggest "*simple* fix" screwup is a failure to add tactile indicators (i.e., "bumps") to the overhead garage door opener buttons so you can *feel* for the desired button in a darkened vehicle (instead of accidentally pushing one of the *other* buttons located nearby).
It would be fun to design the "user interface" in a car!
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Don Y posted for all of us...

More like the salvage yard. You got airbags & tensioners going off slightly before crumpling occurs. Major $$$ hit. I question repairs. Some shops were doing dangerous "clips" before these innovations. Of course you pay in purchase price and insurance. More Fire Co. calls for smoke after a crash and the reinforced areas are just that. More work with the tool.
--
Tekkie

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On 11/28/2015 1:52 PM, Tekkie® wrote:

(sigh) When I was in (high) school, a buddy's shiny new Audi (?) got *ss-ended by another friend's "old chevy" (?). They were exiting the school parking lot doing ~15MPH (?) coasting into the stop sign at the end of the driveway. Audi stopped, then pulled into the roadway. Chevy saw Audi continue into the roadway and turned his attention to the left (to track the oncoming vehicle in the roadway to judge when *he* could enter).
Audi apparently had a change of heart and reapplied brakes before entering roadway.
No trunk left. Back seat would be difficult to sit in.
Chevy had *no* apparent damage!
Later, discovered that a piece of Chevy's grillwork had snapped from the "stress of the impact". A bit of epoxy and all was well. Audi was, IIRC, totalled.
Nowadays, fender benders are the real issue. And, unortunately, you only have *half* of a "say" in that possibility!
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Don Y wrote:

Looks like fender bender but total write off. Neighbor's kid in junior hockey team(dad was a NHL player for some years, a nice family) car had some front driver side fender damage but did not look good coz windows was smashed. Sure enough it was a write off. Similar thing happened to my kid with his first Subaru RS(non turbo) Tow truck driver did not like the looks of the damage. He was right. We are just thankful he became a decent driver after going thru 3 cars.
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On 11/27/2015 9:29 PM, Don Y wrote:

Sounds like you should tilt those headlights down a bit, so you don't keep (knowingly) blinding other drivers. That's quite inconsiderate to keep blinding other drivers after being asked many times, and knowing that you've been asked many times, to dim the brights.
--
.
Christopher A. Young
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On 11/28/2015 5:42 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Tell the factory that! Car rides up higher than a regular car -- should all truck drivers deliberately point their lights at the ground (instead of "aiming" them as required?)
Should folks not be allowed to use halogen and HID lights because they're brighter??
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Halogen headlights usta be illegal in CA. Lotta bikers got busted cuz the CHP knew chopper riders invariably customized their bikes to include illegal halogen headlights for better see-ability.
So, I was shocked when I got a new job in Silly-Con Valley (long time ago) that required me to commute at O-dark-thirty. Seems half the cars on the road had these newer, brighter, headlights. So bright, they gave me a headache. I usta let my hatchback rear window remain dirty jes to diminish the brightness of following vehicles.
So, upside, can see better. Downside, $300 sunglasses! ;)
nb
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On 11/28/2015 8:46 AM, notbob wrote:

We found the problem was the actual "height" of the lights. E.g., when a truck's headlamps are at the level of your head, while seated, it doesn't matter how bright they are; they're "in your eyes".
People behind you tend to *stay* behind you. So, wherever their headlights are (focused) now, they will remain there for the foreseeable future.
OTOH, an oncoming vehicle's headlamps will pass *through* the point of focus "in your eyes" before the vehicle gets to your location; it won't *stay* in that "unsweet spot" indefinitely (unless you are both sitting at a traffic interchange waiting for the signal to change!)
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...unless they are following you at half a car-length and/or driving one of those 4WD "land yacht" trucks/suvs and their "illuminate Cincinnati" headlights are "in yer face".
Sheesh! You relate all the proper technical answers, but seem to have never done any real life commuting or even any real driving. I think you need to get a "real life" clue. ;)
nb
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On 11/28/2015 11:04 AM, notbob wrote:

Did you *read* what I wrote?
"People behind you tend to stay behind you."
I.e., if they are "half a car-length" behind you they will STAY half a car length behind you -- unlike oncoming cars where the distance changes with each passing instant!
"So, wherever their headlights are (focused) now, they will remain there for the foreseeable future"
I.e., "in yer face" -- and they will *stay* "in yer face"!
You should, perhaps, think more carefully about what I've written before complaining about my lack of "real life" experience.
(Or, should I be writing at a THIRD grade level, instead??)
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In painful detail.

They do!?

Hard to see anything when halogen/HID headlights are giving one a migraine.

Unless they pass, then the next car moves up to half a car-length.

You think about it. I commuted fer 25 yrs and drove a semi fer 5.

Yer that old? I was wondering, but didn't wanna say anything. ;)
nb
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On 11/28/2015 11:42 AM, notbob wrote:

So, you've aid a lot -- and avoided the realization that you failed to understand what I wrote. De Nile is a long river.

And that qualifies you for what, exactly? By your logic, a 100 year old driver would be the most "qualified"??

(sigh) Ad hominem attacks. Last refuge for the inept. I think trump is looking for a running mate; you should give him a call! At the very least, he may let you drive his "tour bus"!
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notbob wrote:

Rear view and side view mirrors. It needs some "get used to" but they help in the night.
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