ladder stand-off question

I've been cleaning my gutters by leaning the ladder right up against the gutters, but this seems to be a bad long term solution. I see the aluminum gutters being squished in by my weight, and I'm sure it's just a matter of time before I crunch one.
So, it seems that the thing to do is get a ladder stand-off to push the ladder away from the wall so that it clears the gutter. However, when I went around to the local shops (including a Lowes) to get one, they all claim to push the ladder out by 10 inches. Well, my eaves stick out further than that (probably at least a foot) plus the with of the gutter (5 or 6 inches), so there is no way that the one's I have seen are going to help the ladder clear the gutter. I asked for advice from some of the guys at the mom-and-pop type hardware stores, but just got an "I don't know" type answer.
If I lean the ladder up against the wall below the gutter (even with the spacer), I don't think I could safely get my head above gutter height to see what I'm doing.
I've cleaned the gutters from the roof, but the pitch is a bit too steep for me to feel safe - especially if it's a bit wet.
I've heard the idea of sticking a piece of 2x4 in the gutter where you are resting the ladder, but it seems you've got to put the ladder up there and climb up first before you can do that. And then it would obstruct the gunk that you wanted to get out of the gutter.
At the highest places, the gutters are 15 to 20 feet above the ground.
So what's the solution?
Thanks.
-Jonathan
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Go up over the gutter. Put the legs of the stand-off on the roof. Liz
Jonathan Joseph wrote:

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Liz MacDonald wrote:

I saw this suggestion posted somewhere else, but it doesn't seem practical. Unless the pitch of the roof is very steep, it seems like you still wouldn't have enough clearance.
If you can read my poor ascii drawing below (Ladder labeled with "L", stand-off labled with "-") you will see what I mean. In reality, the ladder will be angled tward the roof, but the amount of that angle will only change the distance to the roof by an insignificant amount in the few inches above the gutter where the stand-off will have to be. And you only do as well as the drawing if you manage to have the standoff be just above the gutter line - not easy with a ladder that increases in increments of about one foot. And if the ground slopes at all, or you move the ladder in or out a bit, you will change that height as you move to the next location. It seems that you're much more likely to have the case where the ladder contacts the gutter before the standoff contacts the roof. The standoff could be angled down into the roof, reducing the distance required but then the exact height of the stand-off would be even more crucial.
I just don't see how a 10" standoff is going to cut it. Am I missing something?
* L **** L *******------L **********|_|L * L * L * L
twice_redeemed wrote:
> After you figure out how to clean them, buy some of those gutter > protectors that keep leaves out, some are strips of screen material, > and you will never have the problem again. Cleaning gutters every year > is a pain.
I don't want to start yet another thread about the merits (or lack thereof) of gutter protector systems.
Thanks.
-Jonathan
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replying to Jonathan Joseph, Charlie wrote: Johnathan, My husband and I have used the gutter liners, the things that says it keeps the leaves out, nothing works for protecting gutters. Best thing is just blow them out with a smaller size blower.
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After you figure out how to clean them, buy some of those gutter protectors that keep leaves out, some are strips of screen material, and you will never have the problem again. Cleaning gutters every year is a pain.
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Jonathan Joseph wrote:

Is it an extension ladder? Why not shorten it? With standoffs, the top of the ladder would be a little below the gutter.
If you lean a ladder against a gutter, the angle is important. You want just enough weight against the gutter to keep the ladder from falling backwards. OSHA recommends that for every foot of height to the point of contact, the foot of the ladder be brought out 1/4 foot. So if the gutter is 20 feet high and 18" out, you set the foot of the ladder 6-1/2 feet from the wall (18" + 20/4').
If you weigh 200 and stand on the run 15 feet high to work, the amount of your weight against the gutter will be 1/4 x 3/6 or 3/16 or 38 pounds, or 19 pounds on each rail.
Moving the foot of the ladder farther from the house increases the pressure against the gutter and the tendency of the foot to slide away from the house.
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Jonathan Joseph wrote: (snip)

(snip)
You may need to order something like:
24" stand off: http://www.globalwholesalersinc.com/_standout_stabilizers.htm
or
Stand off designed to rest on the roof: http://www.ladder-max.com /
-- Mike.
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Thanks for the links. I did some poking around myself after writing the initial message, and I see they do manufacture these things with larger amounts of stand off - you just can't seem to get 'em around here.
I thought one of the people I asked at the local hardware store should have been able to point me in the right direction. Ah well. Live and learn.
-Jonathan
Mike Paulsen wrote:

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After 11 years lets hope he has figured out how to keep them clean.
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