Knob & Tube wiring - when did it stop?

Page 1 of 2  
Looking for info on when they stopped using knob & tube for new commercial buildings in the Northeastern USA.
Thanks for any info.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

it appeared to end around 1950 but codes back then were regional or community based so a limited amount was installed after that.
a excellent product of the time, thats totally inadquate today.
Its the model A of wiring, the ford model A would never be approved to be sold as new today........
its a collectors item at best
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
snipped-for-privacy@aol.com wrote:

For that matter, if the development of gasoline engine automobiles was somehow delayed until the start of the 21st century, our hired hands in gummint would never approve a moving vehicle carrying such a significant amount of highly flammable liquid, much less let them be parked in garages under bedrooms in which homeowners sleep. <G>
Jeff
--
Jeffry Wisnia
(W1BSV + Brass Rat \'57 EE)
  Click to see the full signature.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

You can find lots of info in the book " Old Electrical Wiring " by David E. Shapiro
The NFPA writes the National Electric Code, but it is and has always been superceded by any local codes. In the 1960's grounded circuits were required, so that pretty much ended the use of K&T. My understanding is that Cleveland used it right up until this point. It's also written that some areas in Louisiana used it up until the 80's because it worked well in areas that flooded often. My personal experience with K&T is that if it's left in it's original condition without being tampered with, the stuff would last forever. I've never found any wiring type, up until thermoplastic, that has held up as well
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Right. The local electrical unions had a lot to say about when the installation of K&T stopped. My former house in the Cleveland, OH area had K&T and it was built in 1958. I think areas in and around Chicago were installing it after Cleveland though.
TKM
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
replying to RBM, engineer/realtor wrote: I have a couple of rental properties with K&T (sometimes referred to as knob and spool). Attic access is limited and usually damage to suspended wiring is a result of crawling around in the attic. I changed out the plugs to 3 prong and was surprised to find the insulation in really good shape. For the most part, Europe does not reference their power systems to ground and use 220 distribution. They have fewer lightning problems, can use smaller conductors, have plugs that disconnect before anyone can touch prongs. Safety is less a problem. GFCI's are not required outside and in wet areas.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Saturday, May 21, 2016 at 11:44:05 AM UTC-4, engineer/realtor wrote:

I assume you mean you changed the non-grounded receptacles to ones with ground? Since K&T has no ground, what did you do about that? The only code compliant solution I know of is to use GFCI.
How For the most

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
replying to trader_4, engineer/realtor wrote: I also changed the fuse panel to a breaker panel. The breakers servicing the plugs are now GFCI.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
if anyone has K&T in a home, call state farm or other homeowners insurance companies, and ask about buying a new policy.
sorry no will be the response.
since anyone who buys a home with a mortage must have homeowners insurance. it makes the home impossible to sell......
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Saturday, May 21, 2016 at 1:07:52 PM UTC-4, bob haller wrote:

Unless it sells for cash...
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Sat, 21 May 2016 17:50:14 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03

Hmm. I have a friend who bought a house like that about 4 years ago and I don't think he had enough money to pay cash.
I liked it, because it was old, but he replaced all the wiring himself, and a lot of other stuff. I don't know what he did about insurance. I'm sure he bought some.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Sunday, May 22, 2016 at 12:03:43 AM UTC-4, Micky wrote:

hey may have been required to replace all the wiring within a timeframe like 30 days
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

I'm pretty sure it took him 3 or more likely 6 months. He was probaby preparing for other repairs too, redoing the kitchen, new furnace, repairing the barn. Plus he runs his own business, including doing sales, "management", and often service calls because it's so hard to find competent technicians. He also often takes emergency service calls during off hours. He also rides a horse 2 to 4 times a month, and to get a discount on the horse, he mucks stalls, which takes time, though he might not have done any of that when he first got the house. He also takes vacations, including one where he was on a miniature cattle drive. Plus one to a car show in upstate NYS. Plus he's married, though maybe he has no time for his wife! But he does do chores for his mother-in-law, who's a widow. Oh yeah, he was president of the Buick club for years, but now I think he's only in charge of their shows, whatever they are called. (Once a year they get a Buick dealer to lend them space for a day, etc. and get 30 or 40 restored or partially restored or never needed restoring Buicks from members to display.) He used to be a boy scout leader too but he gave that up. He restores old Buicks but that's been on hold since he bought the new used house.
I don't like to "pry" into his business life, but I think this is the kind of question I can ask him. But I'm not going to call him special. I plan to post more details once I get them.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
wrote:

He might have gotten the mortgage when they weren't asking questions. Is that possible, that they wouldn't insist on speedy replacement of the knob and tube? Wait a second. It's the insurance company, not the mortgage company, that asks those questions. ?? Would the mortgagee ever not require insurance, even during the liar-loan period?
The guy who arranged the mortgage on the home and outbuilding he bought for his business said if he applied now (5 years ago), he couldn't get the mortgage. (His office is on the second floor and attic. He remodeled the whole house and rents the first floor to two business tenants. He rents the basement to another one -- it was a church for a while!! He also remodelled the outbuilding, which was partly a garage but quite a bit bigger than most, and he rents that to another business. When fully rented the 4 are about enough to pay the mortgage. Probably paid someone for all the remodeling since it's clearly deductable, but that costs money too. I don't know how that money is borrowed (the original mortgage or a second loan?) But he made it through the recession and is, he told me about a year ago, making money now. More clients are paying their bills, for one thing. I'd like him to be a rich man by the time he retires but the clock is ticking down.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Sunday, May 22, 2016 at 12:03:43 AM UTC-4, Micky wrote:

Here's an interesting coincidence...
My first recollection of knob and tube wring is noticing the remains of it at my Great-Aunt's house. She was my beloved Godmother and I some a lot of time in her house while growing up. The knobs and some of the cables could be seen in the joist bays of the dirt floor basement. That wiring is one of my first recollections of being interesting in how houses worked.
My current house, which my Godmother gave me a chunk of money for, still has some of the next generation wiring, braided cloth sheathed NM (what some people call cloth covered Romex). On the jacket of some of the cable is the name of the manufacturer: Narragansett.
Ok, here comes the coincidence...
My Godmother's house is located on Narragansett Blvd. When I see that cable in my basement, it often reminds me of Ciocia Josie and her really neat old house. I like to think she's still around, still making sure I'm OK.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Sun, 22 May 2016 06:13:22 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03

I think old houses inspire interest more readily.

That's a good island.

You haven't burned the house down have you? No serious traffic accidents?
20 or 30 years after my grandmother got old, moved out of her house where she and my GF had lived for 15 years, and moved in with her daughter, around 1960, I went to see her house. The new owner (black, fwiw) had fixed it up nicely (much nicer than when my GP's had it) and he showed me the basement, where he had found a target range. Only about half of the basement was 8 feet deep, and the rest was about 3 feet deep and there was only the light that bounced in from the other half (which didn't reach to the end), and at the far end of the second part, he found targets, with holes in them. And bullets too. I can't imagine it was my GF, so it was someone 1945 or earlier who used that target range.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On Sunday, May 22, 2016 at 11:18:46 PM UTC-4, Micky wrote:

It's not worth anything. Why would you even bother mentioning that?

Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 5/23/2016 7:00 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:

Center posted, with no text trimmed. As yours was.
--
.
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
  Click to see the full signature.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
On 5/23/2016 7:00 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:

Saves us from having to ask if they were illegal Mexicans.
BTW, here is a demonstration of trimmed text, and bottom posting. You might learn some thing.
--
.
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
  Click to see the full signature.
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload
replying to bob haller, engineer/realtor wrote: I had no problem getting insurance on these properties. But I also kept my mouth shut and their inspector just did a drive by. They are insured as rentals and at highway robbery rates...
Add pictures here
<% if( /^image/.test(type) ){ %>
<% } %>
<%-name%>
Add image file
Upload

Related Threads

    HomeOwnersHub.com is a website for homeowners and building and maintenance pros. It is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.