Is this normal?

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Hi everyone,
I need your advice if possible.
We called a local contractor to give us a free estimate for a minor repair (a few shingles need to be replaced after a recent wind storm). He came over and quickly applied some kind of a temporary patch and told my wife that he would give as call to discuss this and then he left. The next day I noticed lots of dents on the garage roof that weren't there before. Apparently that's where he placed his ladder to be able to access the area that needed work. Here is the picture:
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/3.jpg
The arrow indicates the area that needed work. The white dots are the dents that I noticed.
Here's a couple of more detailed pictures of the damage taken from inside the house:
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/2.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/1.jpg
There are actually many more dents than seen on these pictures as if he needed to reposition his ladder a few times.
I have a few questions. Do the shingles look damaged badly enough that they need to be replaced? Can he claim that was the only way to reach the upper roof? Could have he avoided this? Can we hold him repsonsible for the damage he caused or that's normal? Shouldn't he have some kind of a stabilizer or a stand-off or whatever you call it to avoid resting the ladder directly on the roof? Why would he need to reposition his ladder so many times to apply a patch to cover such a small area (just a few missing shingles all in the same place)?
What I find frustraing is that we wanted him to just give us a free estimate and possibly replace maybe a dozen missing shingles, that's all. He hasn't done that yet but he has already damaged a dozen more :(
What woud you do in our place?
Your input is greatly appreciated.
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Hi everyone,
I need your advice if possible.
We called a local contractor to give us a free estimate for a minor repair (a few shingles need to be replaced after a recent wind storm). He came over and quickly applied some kind of a temporary patch and told my wife that he would give as call to discuss this and then he left. The next day I noticed lots of dents on the garage roof that weren't there before. Apparently that's where he placed his ladder to be able to access the area that needed work. Here is the picture:
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/3.jpg
The arrow indicates the area that needed work. The white dots are the dents that I noticed.
Here's a couple of more detailed pictures of the damage taken from inside the house:
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/2.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/1.jpg
There are actually many more dents than seen on these pictures as if he needed to reposition his ladder a few times.
I have a few questions. Do the shingles look damaged badly enough that they need to be replaced? Can he claim that was the only way to reach the upper roof? Could have he avoided this? Can we hold him repsonsible for the damage he caused or that's normal? Shouldn't he have some kind of a stabilizer or a stand-off or whatever you call it to avoid resting the ladder directly on the roof? Why would he need to reposition his ladder so many times to apply a patch to cover such a small area (just a few missing shingles all in the same place)?
What I find frustraing is that we wanted him to just give us a free estimate and possibly replace maybe a dozen missing shingles, that's all. He hasn't done that yet but he has already damaged a dozen more :(
What woud you do in our place?
Your input is greatly appreciated.
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I don't get those deep depressions ... caused by roof jacks?
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On Fri, 8 Dec 2006 18:26:58 -0500, "Charles Schuler"

IMHO:
Looks like caused by poor quality roofers, and poor qualify inspectors(their bosses).
Contact the builder/roofing contractor.
later,
tom @ www.MeetANewFriend.com
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Tom The Great wrote:

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snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

Simply inform the contractor that he is going to fix those areas. If he doesn't, then take him to small claims court to pay the bill for someone else to fix it.
In the future, never let anyone do any work without having a contract in place, no matter how well meaning they are.
-john-
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snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

the ground.
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No its not normal, your free bidder was a hacker. I dont know what I would do honestly, first id call the City lisence, Inspector dept , and have a discuss on your Hacker they have a lisence on.
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Hi everyone,
I need your advice if possible.
We called a local contractor to give us a free estimate for a minor repair (a few shingles need to be replaced after a recent wind storm). He came over and quickly applied some kind of a temporary patch and told my wife that he would give as call to discuss this and then he left. The next day I noticed lots of dents on the garage roof that weren't there before. Apparently that's where he placed his ladder to be able to access the area that needed work. Here is the picture:
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/3.jpg
The arrow indicates the area that needed work. The white dots are the dents that I noticed.
Here's a couple of more detailed pictures of the damage taken from inside the house:
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/2.jpg
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o109/iazh5/1.jpg
There are actually many more dents than seen on these pictures as if he needed to reposition his ladder a few times.
I have a few questions. Do the shingles look damaged badly enough that they need to be replaced? Can he claim that was the only way to reach the upper roof? Could have he avoided this? Can we hold him repsonsible for the damage he caused or that's normal? Shouldn't he have some kind of a stabilizer or a stand-off or whatever you call it to avoid resting the ladder directly on the roof? Why would he need to reposition his ladder so many times to apply a patch to cover such a small area (just a few missing shingles all in the same place)?
What I find frustraing is that we wanted him to just give us a free estimate and possibly replace maybe a dozen missing shingles, that's all. He hasn't done that yet but he has already damaged a dozen more :(
What woud you do in our place?
Your input is greatly appreciated.
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real roofer that fixes the original damage can do it. Stuff like this is why it is always good to have part or all of a bundle of the original shingles stashed in a corner of the basement, so you can get a same-batch color match.
As to the first idiot- write it off as an expensive lesson- it would cost you more to sue than you would ever recover. Definitely don't let him touch your roof again. Looks like he used one of those telescoping 'estimator's ladders', rather than a real ladder, to get up there, and then pulled it up after himself to get to second floor roof. He never should have touched garage roof at all- a 20 or 24 foot extension would have easily reached upper roof from the end of the house. Must have been a sunny day, or the caps on the bottom of his ladder legs must be missing or worn out.
aem sends...
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Yup, nothing else really makes any sense, sad though it must be for the OP.
It appears that there isn't any immediate leak. Hopefully, that will give the OP sufficient time to find a decent roof guy, check references etc.
I sort of glad that I had a very minor roof problem last year. I now have what seems to be a really good local roofing firm in my database. At least I know who to call if a more serious/urgent problem should happen to arise this winter.
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I would call in a professional roofer, find out what it would cost to fix the new dents, because that aint right, and bill the first roofer for the cost of his damage. it looks like you have about 10 more years of good service to expect from the remaining shingles on your roof.
i think you are in a bad situation, i dont really know what else to tell you. that guy damaged your roof, you need for him to fix it, but can you trust him?
On 8 Dec 2006 15:04:24 -0800, snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

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My question would be, what kind of roofer would set a ladder on a comp. roof. There should be Tar paper under the shingles, that should stop water from penetrating. I'll bet he went up there and spread wet patch around. Well I guess you figured out by now your roofer is incompetent. On the down side I would not be surprised if you receive some kind of bill. If you think your going to get him to pay for the damaged shingles, good luck with that. What I would suggest is call a couple roofers Check there contractors license. It sound like a small job but you might check for liability insurance and Workmen's comp insurance. Like I say it's a small job but if done wrong it will be costly.

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snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote in

Yes, Hackers-r-Us f*ed up your roof. Now there are entry points for water to get under the shingles and/or paper. The damaged shingles should be popped out and replaced. IF you could get Hackmaster back out there he would probably just slop some roof cement over it. Would that work? Probably. Will it look like shit? Definitely.
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On 8 Dec 2006 15:04:24 -0800, snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

I don't have much experience, but I think maybe after the damage has been there for a while, it will weather and not be as visible. Right now that part of the roof is freshly scuffed. Also, if the material is compressed, can't tell from the picture, it may spring back after a while. (I had a coiled electric razor cord that a psycho used when I was out of town, and then tightly wrapped the cord around the razor, and it took 2 years to get back to normal.)
In addition, you won't notice it much after a while. I have a streak of red paint on my driver's side side mirror, where I scraped the thick post at a drive-through, and I've only noticed it 3 times in the last year, and one of those I went looking on purpose, wondering if it was still there. No matter how bad it is, you won't notice it as much as time goes on, and this doesn't seem so bad to me.
I would get the real roofer to give you a two-part estimate, and inform the first guy how he damaged your roof and what it is going to cost to repair it, and ask him to send a check. But don't get too exorcised if he doesn't, because he won't. But also explain to him why you won't be hiring him or recommending him to anyone else. If this is going to upset you or get you angry, just put it in a letter. Maybe this will stop him from damaging other houses.
He seems like an eager beaver, so include a warning that he is not to fix it himself and you will consider it trespassing if he comes on your property again. Maybe you should just write.

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mm wrote:

Good advice. Clearly this guy was a hack and I'd be pissed too. With either the estimate to repair his damage, or better yet, the actual repair bill, plus your excellent photos, if he doesn't pay up, which is likely, you could take him to small claims court. The amount probably isn't worth your time, but often people wind up there not for the money, but for the principle. I'd say you will win, he might not even show up. But the bigger problem is then actually collecting, as many of these type guys do a good job of making themselves judgement proof. Still, if you get a judgement against him, it could prevent him at some point from getting a loan for a new truck or buying a house, at which point he might choose to pay you.

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On 9 Dec 2006 07:17:09 -0800, snipped-for-privacy@optonline.net wrote:

I think I meant to say "exercised".

There is a popular expression, "When people say it's not the money but the the principle, it's the money", but Marilyn Milyan, the judge on the People's Court says it is usually the principle that gets people to small claims court. I think she's right, and I'm sure the first sentence is overly cynical.

Not if the company owns the truck. I don't know what it means if he owns his truck personally.

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mm wrote:

I was thinking along the lines that this hack owns the company and is not incorporated, which is frequently the case. If it's a sole proprietorship and he gets a judgement, he can go after any of the assets of the business, as well as his personal assets. Also, if he goes to buy a new truck and wants to finance it, or take out a mortgage, etc, they will check his personal credit history and an outstanding judgement will then be a problem for him. Even if he's incorporated, while you couldn't go after the company's assets directly, an unpaid judgement would still present a problem for him in the above circumstances. For a small fry company like this, any lender is going to look at his personal credit history. In fact, I know guys that own incorporated, successful businesses doing several million a year, been in business for 30 years, where the bank wants them to personally guarantee loans to the corp.
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Thank you all good people for your replies. You will probably be shocked to find out that this guy IS a professional roofer or/and represented a roofing company. I checked their website. A locally owned family business since 1939! Licensed. Bonded. Insured. A registered BBB member with one resolved complaint. Well sort of resolved -- the customer still wasn't satisfied. Also, the company was renamed (why?) three years ago, so the BBB doesn't have much info on them.
Several of you noted that it would be difficult for me to make him pay for the damage. Based on the info above, I believe it will be a lot easier for me to deal with him, will it not?... Unless he says "I didn't do it"... Is there a way to prove it is a recent damage?
Could someone please explain the "bonded" part? How does this work? We haven't even signed a contract. He came over for a free estimate, did the damage and off he went.
Thanks.
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snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrote:

Bonded means that he has a performance bond arrangement set up. That means that if he does some damage and has to pay a bill, the bonding company will pay it in the event that the contractor is unable to do so. The contractor pays a fee for this service. For example, to get a $50,000 bond, he may have to put $1,500.
Where this is important for you is if the contractor tears up your house, and then never comes back to finish the job. The bond would be used to pay another contractor to finish the work.
-john-
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